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Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#261

Post by Loughla »

lettergram wrote: post #241
joeblau wrote: post #65

Random diamond story! As a freshman in college, I took a geology class and our teacher asked all of the women in our class to raise their hand if they would rather have natural or human-made diamonds. Most of the women (over 80%) raised their hands for natural. The reasons they gave all seemed to tie back to branding and natural diamonds being “real.” Then our teacher gave another analogy. He asked if people would ra…

While I personally don’t think natural diamonds are any more valuable than synthetic. I understand the scarcity and way it’s used to show status (similar to cars, we don’t need great ones). That being said, what I actually took away from that comment... was that the teacher in geology class was presenting effectively political argument as opposed to teaching. Explaining the process of fine, but given what you describ…

>I think everyone kinda knows about synthetic diamonds, they just don’t care.

I 100% disagree. The stigma around cubic zirconia and 'fake' jewelry is real and alive, and absolutely carries over to any kind of man-made gems. I also don't think most people have any idea at all about the issues in the gem trade. Source: My highly educated co-workers who were astounded to read about conditions in emerald mines after Elon Musk got popular.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#262

Post by jogjayr »

grw_ wrote: post #164
joeblau wrote: post #65

Random diamond story! As a freshman in college, I took a geology class and our teacher asked all of the women in our class to raise their hand if they would rather have natural or human-made diamonds. Most of the women (over 80%) raised their hands for natural. The reasons they gave all seemed to tie back to branding and natural diamonds being “real.” Then our teacher gave another analogy. He asked if people would ra…

The economics behind diamonds are better explained by an sociologist, not a geologist- the high cost and useless-ness of the gift are a feature not a bug! The burning of significant amount of wealth is a costly signal of commitment to the receiver. I heard from a friend who worked at a diamond company (and as such could purchase stones with significant discount to market price) that his fiancée had specifically rejec…

> The burning of significant amount of wealth is a costly signal of commitment to the receiver.

So why not buy something practical and expensive? Like a house or a car?

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#263

Post by sandworm101 »

vagrantJin wrote: post #197
qw wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's mostly about the emotional attachment. If you find two identical pens, and one of them was used by a famous writer, you would expect a price difference. There is no difference in the quality of those pens. They both work the same, and using the writer's pen will not make you a better writer by itself. I personally would not buy a natural diamond because of the ethical issues, but I do understand the students who…

"Okay class, child labour, a few thousand poor people dead, terrorist groups starving hundreds of thousands, destroying schools and libraries. That is where diamonds come from. How many would still want a natural diamond because diamonds are forever?" The elephant in that lecture hall was probably the hypocrisy. I think if you still raise a hand after hearing all that, the issue isn't branding at all. It's narcissim,…

Don't apply logic to fashion choices. Why do some sneakers sell for thousands? It is all about the attached backstory. Two identical shoes, but one was owned by a celeb. The backstory, the notoriety of owning the embodiment of that backstory, is the value. Some people want to own something 'from the earth'. Some would even pay more for an object that people suffered to produce. Lots of people certainly pay more for objects that come from animals suffering. Blood diamonds are no different than ivory or tiger parts, the backstories of which are so valuable that we enact laws to destroy their market.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#264

Post by falcor84 »

offtop5 wrote: post #215
vagrantJin wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Okay class, child labour, a few thousand poor people dead, terrorist groups starving hundreds of thousands, destroying schools and libraries. That is where diamonds come from. How many would still want a natural diamond because diamonds are forever?" The elephant in that lecture hall was probably the hypocrisy. I think if you still raise a hand after hearing all that, the issue isn't branding at all. It's narcissim,…

It also factors into how someone grew up. I'd rather toss 10k into a couple emergency fund then waste it on a ring. Most marriages collapse due to money. I recall in my younger days I was with a girl and she dragged me to Brooks Brothers. As a child of poverty and evictions I couldn't understand why anyone who need to spend this much money on a shirt. Even making well into the 6 figures I shop at Old Navy. Hell, my f…

>Most marriages collapse due to money.

Some studies on factors leading to divorce do put 'money' (and particularly attitudes regarding money) as the biggest single factor, but I'm not familiar with any study (let alone a consensus) that it's a leading factor in 'most' divorces.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#265

Post by notyourday »

Loughla wrote: post #256
notyourday wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the alternative universe women who can't afford diamonds, buy diamonds for men. In the same alternative universe, the families of men look at the Cs of the ring and judge if "she is good enough for him". In the same alternative universe, men get together, pull out their diamond rings and discuss if those rings are worth the sacrifice. And in the same alternative universe the commercials on TV are "She went to Jare…

>In the same alternative universe, the families of men look at the Cs of the ring and judge if "she is good enough for him". In the same alternative universe, men get together, pull out their diamond rings and discuss if those rings are worth the sacrifice. You might need to take a break and take a walk away from media. Do you honestly think this is a thing for all women? Do you honestly believe life is like a televi…

> Do you honestly think this is a thing for all women?

Do those women care about diamonds?

> Do you honestly believe life is like a television sitcom or romantic comedy?

Pandora would not have been a company with a 75B market capitalization if it was selling niche luxury goods. LVMH is only 4x its size.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#266

Post by globular-toast »

kwdc wrote: post #228

Diamonds are cheap. You can tell by their resale value.

A general life pro tip is before buying anything expensive, check the resell value. If there is no second hand market, then it's a consumable. Aim to minimise all consumption. The cost of owning something is the depreciation and the insurance policy you take out on it (or just accept the risk). The cost of owning a $10k diamond is likely to be far, far higher than the cost of owning a $10k violin, for example.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#267

Post by Tade0 »

cyberpunk wrote: post #3

Married members of HN, what did you do if you think diamonds are utterly ridiclious however due to societal constraints some kind of ring is required for your SO?

Not married (yet), but I gave my SO an "engagement iPad".

It was around what you would expect an engagement ring to cost you in this region of the world, the lens cover is made out of sapphire crystal so the jewelry aspect is there, and should I perish in an accident the resale value should give her 2-3 months of runway assuming she moves in with my family, considering we have an infant daughter.

On top of that she very much enjoys the practical aspect of this gift.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#268

Post by tom_mellior »

NikolaNovak wrote: post #141
tom_mellior wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> our teacher asked all of the women Sounds like a pretty sexist thing to do. The same question can be asked without putting women on the spot. "If you were to buy a diamond, what would you rather choose?"

My initial instinct agreed with you,but I then wondered if there would actually be a relevant gender difference in answers. In western culture, still today I think,majority of men would be buying and majority of women would be receiving diamonds. It would be interesting if this affects answers. Would a buyer go for more practical cheaper option while receiver goes for more expensive traditional options? Or a differen…

I would expect there to be a gender difference in the US, due to the social influence of marketing. But I don't think highlighting the difference would help the discussion in any way.

If the professor is making an argument that one choice is clearly the rational choice, and then highlights differences in how different groups make that choice, then they are directly implying that some groups are more irrational than others.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#269

Post by grw_ »

rjsw wrote: post #193
grw_ wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The economics behind diamonds are better explained by an sociologist, not a geologist- the high cost and useless-ness of the gift are a feature not a bug! The burning of significant amount of wealth is a costly signal of commitment to the receiver. I heard from a friend who worked at a diamond company (and as such could purchase stones with significant discount to market price) that his fiancée had specifically rejec…

Even if she could get a larger stone for the expected amount that the guy should spend ?

yes, I should have mentioned it was explicitly put to her in those terms

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#270

Post by Loughla »

zaroth wrote: post #184
myfavoritedog wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can turn around and resell a Banksy for something comparable to what you just paid. Try doing that with a diamond. You walk out of the diamond showroom with it, and its resale value plummets to the value of the base metals, the work of the setting, plus a small fraction for what you had just paid for the diamond.

A certified laser etched diamond is a mass produced item that is pretty easy to authenticate. The brand name store selling it to you is invisible once it’s on your hand. There’s no such thing as a “used” diamond. So the diamond is worth whatever it can be bought / sold for online. If walking out of the store drops it’s value, you’re donating to the store. Buy an exactly equivalent stone elsewhere if the price drops t…

I think the issue is that there is no really trustworthy place to go for used diamonds to ensure you're not buying a cheap knock-off or lower grade gem. Most people don't understand cut, clarity, and whatever else are the other ones. Pawn shops are amazing places to buy SUPER cheap jewelry, especially diamonds. The issue is that, unless you definitely know what you're doing, it's super easy to get taken advantage of.

I wish there was a trustworthy clearinghouse/reseller for used jewelry and gemstones. That would be fantastic.

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