FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol • Hacker News Board

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#261

Post by alain_gilbert » Sat, Jan 23, 2021, 9:55 PM UTC

hourislate wrote: post #82

All cells phones, at all times, are tracked everywhere. I'm sure there are 1000's of cameras that are also used to capture visual data (in DC area). Every person flying (domestic/international) is already tracked. MC/VISA/Bank/ATM records are tracked. Every txt, post, voice call, letter you send, package you receive, is tracked (OCR's). Your vehicle is tracked via programs like Onstar, etc, even if you don't sign up…

And yet, the DMV cannot have access to a I94 form even if they already have all the information.

And they also need me to print it so that they can scan it back in their computer system !

What a world we live in.

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#262

Post by travmatt » Sat, Jan 23, 2021, 9:56 PM UTC

grumple wrote: post #163

vmception wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regarding 3 I’ve been thinking of launching a courier service for this that would pollute data on a wide scale. Basically a “phone walking” service that also charges your phone. Could just be a side gig for Uber drivers, having phone lock boxes in their cars. The infrastructure is already there, phone lock boxes for charging exist in airports and nightclubs. This would be one that moves.

Is there a use for this that isn’t to enable criminals?

To protect against harassment: https://www.androidheadlines.com/2019/08/t-mobile-hands-over...

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#263

Post by HNfriend234 » Sat, Jan 23, 2021, 9:56 PM UTC

guilhas wrote: post #120

ForHackernews wrote: post #67

It blows my mind that a bunch of conspiracy-minded folks (the sort of people who won't get a vaccine because they think it contains a tracking chip from Bill Gates) would stage an insurrection and not turn their phones off! Honestly, what did they think was going to happen? As the saying goes, "When you strike at a king, you must kill him." You don't get to fail miserably at your coup and then go back home to your re…

Because no one was there for an insurrection. Thats a conspiracy theory by mainstream media and the democrats

I visit right-wing websites for research purposes and this is actually true. If you visit right wing websites and review posts about the jan 6th protest it was actually related to basically having a peaceful protest to put pressure on the electoral vote. Most of the flyers related to it and were extremely vague. The slogan was simply: "be there, it will be crazy" with no other concrete details.

The reality is that the actual insurrectionists were a small fringe group (Qanon) that managed to convince the rest of the useful idiots to join in. If you watch the videos of the siege you can see that it was mostly Qanon people leading the charge in while the other people simply walked into the building.

Of course comments like mine are not welcome because it paints a different picture compared to the narrative being presented in the media but the facts are still there. I encourage everyone to go online and do your own research. Go to the right-wing websites, pull up posts from December talking about the march and see what is being said. It is all public information. Same with the siege videos, you can watch the livestreams and reach your own conclusions yourself.

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#264

Post by gvd » Sat, Jan 23, 2021, 9:57 PM UTC

simple_phrases wrote: post #121

suifbwish wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

3 raises a very interesting and somewhat concerning possibility. In the near future as AI develops more in the crime detection arena you may become a suspect for crimes occurring in your geographical area based on things you are not doing or based on some set of states your smart devices have that match a statistical model of a suspicious person. The idea of becoming a suspect because you didn’t touch your smartphone…

ML is really good at picking up anomalies, and that is scary if, say, law enforcement or prosecutors are doing dragnet surveillance for anomalies in order to drum up charges.

This is such a general bs statement

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#265

Post by ianhawes » Sat, Jan 23, 2021, 9:58 PM UTC

alain_gilbert wrote: post #261

hourislate wrote: post #82

All cells phones, at all times, are tracked everywhere. I'm sure there are 1000's of cameras that are also used to capture visual data (in DC area). Every person flying (domestic/international) is already tracked. MC/VISA/Bank/ATM records are tracked. Every txt, post, voice call, letter you send, package you receive, is tracked (OCR's). Your vehicle is tracked via programs like Onstar, etc, even if you don't sign up…

And yet, the DMV cannot have access to a I94 form even if they already have all the information. And they also need me to print it so that they can scan it back in their computer system ! What a world we live in.

That is a function of funding. The DMV isn’t well funded but we’ll pay 8 and 9 figure contracts to domestic intelligence agencies.

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#266

Post by dehrmann » Sat, Jan 23, 2021, 9:58 PM UTC

alain_gilbert wrote: post #261

hourislate wrote: post #82

All cells phones, at all times, are tracked everywhere. I'm sure there are 1000's of cameras that are also used to capture visual data (in DC area). Every person flying (domestic/international) is already tracked. MC/VISA/Bank/ATM records are tracked. Every txt, post, voice call, letter you send, package you receive, is tracked (OCR's). Your vehicle is tracked via programs like Onstar, etc, even if you don't sign up…

And yet, the DMV cannot have access to a I94 form even if they already have all the information. And they also need me to print it so that they can scan it back in their computer system ! What a world we live in.

Yeah; on one hand, we're tracked everywhere. On the other, since the systems are so disparate, it takes a lot of leg work to put the data together, even without a warrant. It's better than nothing.

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#267

Post by ficklepickle » Sat, Jan 23, 2021, 10:00 PM UTC

BurningFrog wrote: post #216

Gibbon1 wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well GPS is 1.2 to 1.5GZ and you can get accuracy to a few meters easily. I have a higher end module that gets down to a meter[1]. Seems obvious that G4 which uses roughly same frequencies but with cell towers vastly closer than a GPS satellite could get 1M. [1] Give it a few minutes and it'll pin point where my desk is inside my office.

GPS does not use triangulation. It does some real dark arts physics wizardry to compute a position. Nothing like that can be done for cell phone signals.

Isn't it still triangulation, just accounting for relativity?

You need to lock with multiple satellites, I assumed this was for triangulation.

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#268

Post by rootsudo » Sat, Jan 23, 2021, 10:01 PM UTC

hindsightbias wrote: post #251

ramraj07 wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

3 could also be perfect. Call your friend, let him come pick your phone up and show it a good time, while you go commit a crime, perfect alibi!

Browsing fingerprints would not be the same.

You don't have to browse all the time, if it's a pattern just being alongside friends phone, and your phone is locked - it'd make sense. You're enjoying conversation, he's doing the spotify playlist..

There you go.

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#269

Post by dehrmann » Sat, Jan 23, 2021, 10:02 PM UTC

throwawy4rzn wrote: post #168

LEO using cellphone triangulation is not new. I worked as a network tech for one of the big providers. I was pulling tower location data for LEO regularly at request of corporate legal only. Though sometimes LEO would try to end run around and go to stores who would contact me. I socially engineered them to believe I could not access that info without a code generated by corp legal. Not true, of course. But hell if I…

> LEO using cellphone triangulation is not new.

Everyone was listening to Serial in 2014, and it went into depth on how it was done in the early 2000's.

Re: FBI agents track cell phones that pinged near the Capitol

#270

Post by trhway » Sat, Jan 23, 2021, 10:03 PM UTC

nabla9 wrote: post #33

Forensic methods used by police and intelligence go much deeper than just looking at phones near the crime scene. 1. They look at phones moving towards the crime scene and going dark when getting close. This is also how you can detect secret meetings between people. They move towards the same area and shut down their phones. 2. They look at suspect phone going dark anywhere around the time of the incident. 3. Leaving…

basically leaving you phone or going dark is by itself already suspicious behavior warranting a quick interview with the police AI-based precognition screener and/or dispatch of a police welfare check drone.