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Apple has threatened to remove Amphetamine from the App Store

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Re: Apple has threatened to remove Amphetamine from the App Store

#261

Post by TedDoesntTalk »

DoofusOfDeath wrote: post #224
webmobdev wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but that also doesn't mean you should stop voicing your concerns publicly at injustice. Being angry at some injustice doesn't automatically make you unhappy too, if the anger is used constructively and positively. You can voice your concern and be practical too. The article is actually quite well written and even highlights, with examples, how Apple applies such naming rules arbitrarily. I've said this before -…

> Being angry at some injustice doesn't automatically make you unhappy too I guess I was assuming that anger and happiness are somewhat mutually exclusive.

Learning not to be offended is a great skill to learn.

It applies to both sides here: Apple could continue to choose not to be offended after 6 years. The developer could choose not to be offended at Apple’s decision and rebrand.

Having said that, this is censorship any way you look at it. Whether it’s “valid” censorship depends on your point of view.

Re: Apple has threatened to remove Amphetamine from the App Store

#262

Post by kortex »

zepto wrote: post #71
TheRealSteel wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, meth is an amphetamine. Meth is not amphetamine, amphetamine is a different molecule.

Amphetamine is a general term as well as a proper noun. Both are valid and widely accepted meanings. Meth is amphetamine.

Not really, it's pretty confusing and when I worked at a medicinal chemist working on substituted phenethylamines, no one referred to molecules aside from amphetamine proper as "amphetamine".

Re: Apple has threatened to remove Amphetamine from the App Store

#263

Post by [deleted] »

Angostura wrote: post #226
tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They kind of have a point They don't (the claim is the app promotes drug use, which it doesn't), and it's quite likely that it's a reviewer mistake that will be overturned once the stink on social media gets big enough to reach the right person.

> the claim is the app promotes drug use, which it doesn't You don't think it could reinforce the idea that Amphetamines could be a useful tool to preserve wakefulness?

[deleted]

Re: Apple has threatened to remove Amphetamine from the App Store

#264

Post by Hnrobert42 »

Yetanfou wrote: post #212
hshshs2 wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They’re a $2 trillion dollar company, unless you have an incredibly strong case (this isn’t one) then you will lose a war of attrition every time... even sometimes if you do have a strong case. Choose your battles wisely, live to fight another day, etc... Pound for pound you’d likely be better off putting your energy into policy. The scale is still tilted there, but there is some traction behind fairer app marketplac…

You do this by leaving the platform. There are plenty of alternatives for Apple's products so those who get tired of the ever-increasing censorship inside the walled garden are better off outside of its walls. Eventually the Apple world will become something akin to Disneyland, nothing but "wholesome" infotainment without anything that could give offence.

Do you really believe the app developers should close their doors and stop making the app rather than change their name, all as part of an ideological fight? I just want to make sure that is really your good faith argument.

Re: Apple has threatened to remove Amphetamine from the App Store

#265

Post by danso »

From the writeup:

> Argument #1: Amphetamine Does Not Promote the Use of Illegal Drugs or Facilitate the Sale of Controlled Substances

> Amphetamine does not promote the use of illegal drugs. Not only that, Amphetamine does not promote the recreational use of legal/prescribed drugs. In the United States, amphetamine is prescribed by doctors to adults for narcolepsy and to children for ADHD...

> ...Just like amphetamine (the organic compound) can be legally used to keep humans awake and attentive, Amphetamine (the app) can be legally used to keep your Mac awake."

While "amphetamine" isn't itself an "illegal" drug, promoting the use of amphetamines for anything other than the FDA-approved indications (e.g. narcolepsy and ADHD) is something that can approach illegality [0]. For example, Pfizer and many other companies have had to pay billions to settle charges of promoting drugs for non-approved indications [1].

The author doesn't help his case when he asserts, "amphetamine can be legally used to keep humans awake and attentive". Yes, that's an effect of the drug, but it's only official legal uses are for treating narcolepsy and diagnosed ADHD. Adderall's manufacturer would get in big trouble if it started a campaign to convince doctors (who can basically prescribe for any reason they judge necessary) to get patients on Adderall for general boosting of performance and productivity.

Of course, the author (I assume) isn't in the pocket of Big Pharma. it's also not a stretch to see how this falls afoul of Apple' policy against encouraging the illegal use of drugs, in that the application's very name creates an association between "Amphetamine" and "making your computer more productive". Alcohol isn't an illegal drug either, but as the author notes, Apple explicitly bans encouragement of "consumption of...excessive amounts of alcohol" – i.e. a harmful use of an otherwise legal drug.

To use a hypothetical example, if a developer created an app that reduced screen glare and excessive contrast in UI elements, and then called it Fentanyl, I'd imagine Apple would have the same complaints as it does against Amphetamine, even though Fentanyl is a drug legally prescribed for severe chronic pain.

[0] https://www.healthaffairs.org/do/10.1377/hblog20160719.05588...

[1] https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/justice-department-announces-...

Re: Apple has threatened to remove Amphetamine from the App Store

#266

Post by webmobdev »

mmaunder wrote: post #23

You’re angry. I’ve felt this in a trademark lawsuit. You think the world should get behind you and change the corrupt system. My advice is to immediately rebrand as gracefully and effectively as possible and use all that activist energy to effect the transition. They kind of have a point which doesn’t make them right, but they hold all the cards and you will lose this one and regret the wasted bandwidth.

> My advice is to immediately rebrand as gracefully and effectively as possible and use all that activist energy to effect the transition.

Apple will definitely appreciate it if all of us would just shut up and let them screw us.

While I appreciate your well-meaning advise to the author - pick your battles in life carefully - I'd like to add that using your anger constructively at some injustice is a positive move too. You do have to accept some things in life are beyond your control. But it does not mean you should not be an advocate for necessary change. Speaking up is the beginning. (And in fact, more positive to your well-being). And you can even stop with that. But speak up.

The author has made some good arguments and I urge everyone to read it. Irrespective, of what the author ultimately decides to do, he should be glad for having the courage to speak up. And that many of us appreciate it and support him.

Apple shouldn't forget that while it may have hoodwinked many developers to pay them for the "privilege" of creating and distributing apps on their platform, it is the developers who are the ones adding more VALUE to their platform. And that there's a limit to how much you can abuse and gauge them (one would have that all the law suits on the app store would have made them realised that by now).

Re: Apple has threatened to remove Amphetamine from the App Store

#267

Post by andromeduck »

umvi wrote: post #199

Change the name to "Amph" and change the icon to remove pill. You can't fight Apple, they make and enforce all the rules. If you want to protest Apple, stop developing software for their platforms.

Nah rename it to modafinil

Re: Apple has threatened to remove Amphetamine from the App Store

#269

Post by marmaduke »

adhder wrote: post #253
marmaduke wrote: post #103

I don’t use this and don’t care. But I can imagine my kids asking, what are amphetamines, why is it named that way, did you ever try them, what is it like. Just like you’d say to kids, you don’t ever need to take those pills, maybe you should use your energy to push Apple so that your app isn’t necessary? I certainly try to educate my kids such that they will not be in a position to need those meds. We like to think…

If your kids asked you that, I hope you'd give a reasonable answer about these being prescribed medications for narcolepsy and ADHD, that much improve the quality of life for people afflicted with these conditions. Rather than ignorant shit like "you don't ever need to take those pills".

Sure if that was the case. How many abusers have you seen tho? Have you seen their MRIs after the damage?

Re: Apple has threatened to remove Amphetamine from the App Store

#270

Post by powersnail »

hugi wrote: post #239
Bodell wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly if your name your product stupid things I would think that some of us might be choosing not to download your product as a result. And if a store decides not to sell your product because of this it’s really their prerogative. Saying you violated their terms with impunity for 6 years doesn’t mean they lose the right to correct the mistake. This name is pretty rings rather badly in my ears, though I’m not offen…

Americans being American. "We love freedom of speech but fuck you if your product name mentions a chemical compound or a word I or someone else might find offending".

I don't see how any of these contradict freedom of speech. We are talking about 1) people being offended by a name; 2) a company banning an app on their own app store.

Whether you find the situation distasteful, it has nothing to do with freedom of speech. Neither the offended people nor Apple is infringing on the developer's freedom speech.

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