3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits • Hacker News Board

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#261

Post by SketchySeaBeast » Thu, Mar 26, 2020, 2:38 PM UTC

evan_ wrote: post #244

SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the next couple of weeks are going to be eye opening - we're going to get a lot of reports of deaths, even of the young and healthy, which we're already seeing. That should steel the collective resolve to last a while here. People are talking of lifting the restrictions and our collective endurance and things have barely gotten going. It's really complaining about the length of the red light when it's just tu…

> I'm assuming the government does its job What has led you to make this assumption?

It could very well be a bad assumption, but efforts seem ot be being made now to get people support. Hopefully they get there or this is going to be really bad.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#262

Post by markvdb » Thu, Mar 26, 2020, 2:38 PM UTC

SamuelAdams wrote: post #74

rubber_duck wrote: post #35

And this is just the start. While I think the US response to Corona was slower than the response in my country I feel the US is the only country that's seriously discussing economic repercussions and debating the medical experts. In EU (at least in my country) it's doctors running things and we are in "stop the pandemic at all cost". Everyone is in panic due to Italy situation. But doctors are only trained to see the…

I saw this idea floated around on Reddit a few days ago. Basically the crux is that unemployment has a death toll, too. So if you close all non-essential businesses, unemployment rises, which increases the likelihood of people losing health insurance, losing homes, not paying electrical bills, communication (internet / phone) bills, etc. If some people lose all those things and don't have access to them again for 2+…

You've rightly identified the question as a false dichotomy. People in the US don't _have_ to die for lack of resources.

The state helping the people to survive this crisis or not is a political choice.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#263

Post by wyclif » Thu, Mar 26, 2020, 2:38 PM UTC

9nGQluzmnq3M wrote: post #245

wyclif wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the contrary, setbacks for globalization may very well leave us better off...after all, globalization is one of the main factors why we're experiencing this deadly pandemic now, and have vast swathes of our supply chain for essential pharmaceuticals and medical equipment farmed out to evil, duplicitous regimes like the Chinese state.

Us = the world/humanity, not the USA. China's economic growth has lifted hundreds of millions from poverty, and it would not have happened without globalization.

Eh, I was speaking of the world. China lied about the coronavirus right from the beginning, when having two weeks of lead time worldwide could have saved thousands of lives. They arrested, silenced, and probably killed the doctors who blew the whistle on the cover-up. These are facts, not conjecture.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#264

Post by cloverich » Thu, Mar 26, 2020, 2:39 PM UTC

ian0 wrote: post #85

How is our social system so fragile? I mean seriously - thousands of years and wireless comms and rockets to the moon and not only do we forget to prepare for a virus (something that had happened routinely throughout our history) but when it hits and people have to stay at home for a few weeks the economy falls down and leaves millions of people who want to work unable to do so.

Because people previously (falsely) believed it could not happen in the US, with the last true pandemic being so far in the past. The Bill Gates TED talk from 2016 shows that some people understood what we should have done, but it involves not only changing minds but also putting money into it. Whatever the total fallout from this pandemic, I expect the creation of a medical reserve (as suggested in the talk) is one that will certainly happen.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#265

Post by tathougies » Thu, Mar 26, 2020, 2:40 PM UTC

toomuchtodo wrote: post #25

yulaow wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is usa how the implemented lockdowns work? They forced to shut down all non-essential industries and shops? Or they just suggested it? I am finding confusing information online. Like... Did they really give to the each employer the power to decide if they are essential or not?

The authority has been delegated to states, each state is making their own decisions.

No. The authority was never given to the federal government. Key difference. The federal government cannot grant that which it does not have

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#266

Post by brlewis » Thu, Mar 26, 2020, 2:40 PM UTC

mrfusion wrote: post #116

cjslep wrote: post #32

I grew up with the puritanical mindset of: "Your intrinsic worth as a human is the money you earn; because the money you earn is from how hard you work; and how hard you work is a reflection of your intrinsic Virtue." Thus I grew up in a family that loathes the unemployed. I really hope -- though I have grave doubts -- that this event gets through to them, so that they can have some personal growth, too.

Sadly everyone seems to be doubling down on their existing strong opinions. (Any ideas to improve that?)

At my day job and can't talk in detail now, but yes.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#267

Post by standardUser » Thu, Mar 26, 2020, 2:42 PM UTC

rubber_duck wrote: post #35

And this is just the start. While I think the US response to Corona was slower than the response in my country I feel the US is the only country that's seriously discussing economic repercussions and debating the medical experts. In EU (at least in my country) it's doctors running things and we are in "stop the pandemic at all cost". Everyone is in panic due to Italy situation. But doctors are only trained to see the…

Most wealthy nations already have a robust social safety net in place. They don't need to rush to cobble together a temporary one in the same was the US does.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#268

Post by danans » Thu, Mar 26, 2020, 2:43 PM UTC

chewz wrote: post #163

dragonwriter wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I like to think this event changes people's perspective on folks out of work in the US. Sure, just like the Depression did. And just like the Depression, a few years of boom times afterwards and that effect will be negated until the next similar event.

> And just like the Depression, a few years of boom times afterwards and that effect will be negated Actually Depression changed consumer habits for entire generation. People saved more, spent less, kept money under the mattress etc. Not a generation that you can kick-start an economy with.

It also gave rise to whatever social safety net the US has today.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#269

Post by bin0 » Thu, Mar 26, 2020, 2:45 PM UTC

helen___keller wrote: post #215

My biggest concern is that we aren't working on the infrastructure and cultural shift that is going to be needed to have a return to normal. The endgame of covid-19 is herd immunity, which requires either 30-60% of the population infected and recovered, or it requires a vaccine. Realistically both are probably 9+ months out: vaccines are slow to develop, and almost every governor has proven they'd rather shut down ev…

Cultural changes? How would you build those? The government doesn't control the culture. How would you make it unacceptable? Bureaucrats don't have direct control over that. Also, a bunch of "we need"s about the ideal situation don't do much.

The reason the China contained it is because she is an authoritarian state. While that provides certain advantages in this situation, it comes with certain drawbacks: not being able to access many websites, inability to express your political opinion, inability to own a firearm, being tossed in a concentration camp if the government doesn't like you. This isn't a question of leadership, you're asking the government to do things it literally has no power to do, things entirely outside of the constitution.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#270

Post by kamarg » Thu, Mar 26, 2020, 2:45 PM UTC

wil421 wrote: post #157

alharith wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My brother is a restaurant owner and reports that despite volume being down, profit is up due to less overhead. Others in the restaurant industry are reporting the same. When we come out on the other side of this, I think a lot of businesses are going to rethink a lot of things they held on to as infallible truths. Sorry as many mentioned, yes the key ingredient is takeout: This is a fast casual italian / pizza resta…

Almost every restaurant owner I know is about to fold or taking emergency loans. From people with several franchised sandwich shops to stand alone restaurants. Who is reporting profits are up?

Anecdotally, the owner of one of the nearby pizza places mentioned that both profits and margins are up for her. Of course pizza places historically have a large amount of delivery already. I imagine the current crisis has driven more customers to them at the expense of places that are traditionally dine-in only.