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Angular 9.0

blog.angular.io

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Re: Angular 9.0

#261

Post by stringyham »

madoublet wrote: post #252
Phenix88be wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I m pretty sur the 2500+ issues on github are not all people using Angular wrong. Yet I agree, a lot of things in my project is wrong and maybe blaming the framework for the mess is too easy. But I really do not enjoy working with Angular. Also, learning to use RxJS was a painful experience full of frustration.

I agree with you 100% here. I have been working in Angular for a long time and feel like I have a pretty strong understanding on how it works. Like you, I will not build another app with Angular (or any framework for that matter). I don't think I encountered as many bugs as you have, but I have spent too much time trying to figure out how to do it the Angular way or the RxJS way. With modules, web components, promise…

If you can write the app you need with "modules, web components, promises, and async/await" then you never needed Angular to begin with. And that's a good thing, frameworks/libraries are never the answer to everything and are a decision to be weighed carefully.

Re: Angular 9.0

#262

Post by taway123411 »

kumarvvr wrote: post #81
ENGNR wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It reminds me of the whole .NET ecosystem. All of these custom magical special ways to do everything, compared to ‘dumb’ setups like node/ruby/go where the actual logic is just right there in front of you And every release .NET just keeps moving closer to the dumb systems. Simple and raw is good, keep the magic away

I am really glad there are other people who think this way. I am experienced with Python/JS/Ruby web app development models and recently had a look at ASP.NET Core web api projects. The amount of complexity is mind boggling. I mean, look at Flask in Python. Or even Expressjs in Node, why can't Microsoft come up with a simple framework that can run well on the .NET runtime? I am a huge fan of C#, having used it for De…

Can you elaborate on the "mind boggling" complexity?

Flask is self-described as a "micro framework", which makes it simple to start with, but IMHO difficult to grow into something bigger.

I like the balance the ASP.NET Core 3.0 strikes.

  dotnet new webapp -o HelloWorld
Yields a fully functional site with * HTTPS * Logging * HTML templating * CSS/JS bundling & minification

And all of this is easy to customize and change.

"Web API" projects are even simpler-- it's just a small handful of files.

Re: Angular 9.0

#263

Post by JMTQp8lwXL »

tashoecraft wrote: post #235
JMTQp8lwXL wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The real difference between the two frameworks boils down to developer happiness. In Angular, all of the choices are made for you. For some, the lack of autonomy and agency when writing Angular applications makes those developers sad. It's hard to take pride and ownership in your work when 90% of everything has been decided for you, and if you try to eject from the "Angular" way of doing this, you end up just writing…

This is the biggest “meme” about angular and it’s so unbelievable wrong. It shows that you haven’t used the framework if you think all the choices are made for you. Instead of spending all my time analyzing different open source packages for every single thing you do, you just have access to a first class supported solution. IMO, lots of the react ecosystem is built on engineers trying to show off. They get fancy com…

Unlike most people, I've written both Angular and React extensively: I've shipped both Angular and React web applications in enterprise settings.

I wouldn't characterize my time in React spent "all day comparing open source packages" -- if that's what you think web application development on React looks like on a day-to-day basis, you haven't done much on it.

To be clear, I do not intend to speak negatively about Angular. Some people love the provided structure. It's also not for some other people. This is okay. Different things make different developers happy. I wasn't generally describing all people's sentiment: that would be insane, both frameworks have huge backing. If you'd like to understand more about how some people view the framework as inflexible, and you're open to that perspective, I'm glad to shine some light on it.

Re: Angular 9.0

#264

Post by brlewis »

tashoecraft wrote: post #235
JMTQp8lwXL wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The real difference between the two frameworks boils down to developer happiness. In Angular, all of the choices are made for you. For some, the lack of autonomy and agency when writing Angular applications makes those developers sad. It's hard to take pride and ownership in your work when 90% of everything has been decided for you, and if you try to eject from the "Angular" way of doing this, you end up just writing…

This is the biggest “meme” about angular and it’s so unbelievable wrong. It shows that you haven’t used the framework if you think all the choices are made for you. Instead of spending all my time analyzing different open source packages for every single thing you do, you just have access to a first class supported solution. IMO, lots of the react ecosystem is built on engineers trying to show off. They get fancy com…

> it’s a problem of react devs who take a small view library then build a framework on top of it

This has been solved by create-react-app. I'm working on a 10K+ LOC app now, and the only significant dependencies that aren't part of create-react-app or its docs are d3 and date-fns, which don't belong in a framework anyway.

Re: Angular 9.0

#265

Post by kungito »

tony wrote: post #46

One of the nice things that Angular has you don't see in the post is... very polite and courteous maintainers! https://github.com/angular/angular/pull/33717#issuecomment-5... This was a fast release cycle. It was back in November 2019 we were talking about 3.7, and now it's in. I'm not even thinking about Ivy. But it's nice to have all the nice comforts of typescript ready and working out of the box. (I mainly work i…

It may seem "smooth" but I've been developing some hobby apps from time to time and it was never smooth. From Angular 2.0 release to 8 I've always had to spend 1-2 days to fix some random bugs from undocumented contract changes every time I came back to my projects. I'm speaking just from my amateur experience with 50 file projects.

Re: Angular 9.0

#266

Post by pier25 »

orange8 wrote: post #214
spaceribs wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But whatever floats you boat really You specifically argued against that, your arguments seem to be highly religious in nature. I don't know how many years you've worked in the industry but if you think React will be the dominant way of building apps for the next ten years, I have some Adobe Flash developers who I'm sure would like to say a few words.

haha! Former hotshot Flash ActionScript 3 Ninja Developer reporting for duty as requested. Seriously though, JSX and TypeScript are nothing new. Both were part of ActionScript 3, a big language backed by a powerful company (Adobe). 15 years later, nobody even remembers it existed. How am I still making a comfortable living coding today? By not getting too attached to any language or framework... they are all just too…

Huh? AS3 had XML integrated into it?

I remember E4X and Flex but not a JSX like syntax.

Re: Angular 9.0

#267

Post by strangescript »

remify wrote: post #223
Phenix88be wrote: post #136

After 2 years of Angular madness I will send my resignation and I hope I will never work with it again. My app is a big stack of workaround stuff that might break anytime. Because that is how angular work. Some stuff work in a context and doesn't in an other. Nobody's know why ! They have so much issue on Github that they need a bot to close them after a while. They hope the bug disappear by himself ?

Angular is a framework if you've hack you're way without following best practices you expose yourself to such things. I've been working with Angular2+ for 3 years and I haven't met any bug. Know the concepts, apply them and you'll have an easy trip.

"I've been working with Angular2+ for 3 years and I haven't met any bug."

Give me a break, this isn't true for any code in existence.

Re: Angular 9.0

#268

Post by spaceribs »

doczoidberg wrote: post #172

Just want to say that all the Angular React comparisons are dumb. It is comparing apples to oranges. Angular is a bigger framework for developing more complex stuff. Therefore of course there is a steeper learning curve. Here are comments like "react is so much more easier because it is just functions". Why not just using vanilla js because you have nothing to learn then? Or just use binary code? It is just 0 and 1.

I wholeheartedly agree, this is a false equivalency.

Angular was built specifically around avoiding an entirely different problem that the heavily debated issue here of overengineering: Multiple teams that build out complicated and feature laden systems in parallel need to make concessions to allow interoperability.

If your organization is culturally flat, Angular prevents the core of your application from diverging in unmaintainable ways.

Re: Angular 9.0

#269

Post by madoublet »

stringyham wrote: post #261
madoublet wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you 100% here. I have been working in Angular for a long time and feel like I have a pretty strong understanding on how it works. Like you, I will not build another app with Angular (or any framework for that matter). I don't think I encountered as many bugs as you have, but I have spent too much time trying to figure out how to do it the Angular way or the RxJS way. With modules, web components, promise…

If you can write the app you need with "modules, web components, promises, and async/await" then you never needed Angular to begin with. And that's a good thing, frameworks/libraries are never the answer to everything and are a decision to be weighed carefully.

Agreed. I think the increased support for modules and web components across major browsers in the past year has really given me the confidence that I can go without Angular/React/Vue and still have a well organized project. I still really miss the binding and routing of Angular. But, that is a small compromise.

Re: Angular 9.0

#270

Post by remify »

strangescript wrote: post #267
remify wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Angular is a framework if you've hack you're way without following best practices you expose yourself to such things. I've been working with Angular2+ for 3 years and I haven't met any bug. Know the concepts, apply them and you'll have an easy trip.

"I've been working with Angular2+ for 3 years and I haven't met any bug." Give me a break, this isn't true for any code in existence.

I haven't met a bug related to the angular source code. I've obviously seen bugs in my projects
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