Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction • Hacker News Board

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#261

Post by tomtheelder » Wed, Jan 15, 2020, 11:51 PM UTC

nickelcitymario wrote: post #97

iN7h33nD wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that the aspirations that almost all advertisements give to people are actively harmful in every possible way. - It is the main revenue source of most mentally harmful products like social media. A replacement created for the good of the world paid for by taxes with open data would be much preferred. - Has masked how the world really functions via out-right lies and deception. Coke makes you happy, Happy Cows…

Since you cherry picked the worst examples, let me cherry pick some of the best: - Ads for charities - Political ads (which are only good or bad if you agree or disagree with their positions) - Ads for schools - Movie trailers (a form of entertainment in it of themselves) Also: I suspect (but don't have the means to prove) a positive correlation between advertising spending and national GDP. Look, if your point is th…

> Also: I suspect (but don't have the means to prove) a positive correlation between advertising spending and national GDP.

Is the implication that you believe that's causal? That you think reducing advertising spending would be economically detrimental?

I suspect that isn't true, since it's basically just an arms race. Companies are forced into competing along the axis of marketing (they also choose to since it's more effective than competing on quality), which is a huge money sink.

Also being anti-advertising isn't anti-capitalist. Simply believing that a market should have rules doesn't mean you are anti-market. Personally, I really doubt that advertising is an effective means of job and growth creation. It might even be negative. I suspect capitalism would be healthier without it.

I highly doubt it increases overall consumption, it rather just orients buyers in particular directions, often directions that are detrimental to themselves and to society as a whole.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#262

Post by endothrowho333 » Wed, Jan 15, 2020, 11:54 PM UTC

nickelcitymario wrote: post #200

endothrowho333 wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Prove it.

Interesting challenge. What would constitute proof? I'm not being facetious and I honestly don't know if I could prove it. It's simply a value we hold dear and we're up front about it with our clients and our team. We refuse to be dishonest, because it's bad for business. For context: we're a small agency in a small city. If we either lied to our clients or produced dishonest advertising, we believe we'd be out of bu…

I believe you believe what you wrote.

I will say the same for the same people chastising you.

It all comes down to a difference in perspective, values, and outlook. I don't believe the hate you're getting is justified, but for someone that works in marketing: your copy is unconvincing ;)

Perhaps you didn't frame properly for your audience? You seem more on the defensive instead of the offensive, morphing your position so your detractors can see it from a different angle.

Just some thoughts. It must be draining replying to all of that hate.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#263

Post by ben_w » Wed, Jan 15, 2020, 11:57 PM UTC

therealdrag0 wrote: post #136

TheGallopedHigh wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Said succinctly: Comparison is the thief of joy

Example: Comparing engineering salaries :/. It can be addictive and disheartening to look up salaries and see giant numbers.

Perhaps I’m unusual, but other people earning more than me doesn’t dishearten me. My first job after uni was UK national average for all adults, so I felt well off even on “only” £24k in 2007, but ever since then, no matter how much I get paid, other people keep telling me I don’t earn enough.

If anything, the idea of earning twice as much feels weird rather than aspirational.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#264

Post by paulryanrogers » Thu, Jan 16, 2020, 12:09 AM UTC

chickenchaser wrote: post #137

tombert wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what I find strange too; I can afford to get the new iPhone every year or two if I wanted (most software engineers probably can), and yet I plan on keeping mine until it's dead, broken, or stolen. I don't own a car, but if I did it would probably the cheapest car in reasonably good shape that gets reasonably good gas mileage. There's a part of me that wonders if a lot of it boils down to education. My brother-…

>I can afford to get the new iPhone every year or two if I wanted Maybe that's what the difference is. Being able to afford these things means you might not feel a similar need to posture that you can afford a certain lifestyle that you really can't. I'm guessing that at minimum wage most would struggle financially especially in a large city like NYC, so being able to pull the newest iPhone out of their pocket might…

My wife has had more contact with poorer communities. And she believes it's partly to maintain the appearance of wealth and status. I suspect it's also a luxury within reach versus those which seem impossible: homeownership, choosing ones employer, world travel, etc.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#265

Post by r00fus » Thu, Jan 16, 2020, 12:10 AM UTC

HONEST_ANNIE wrote: post #50

nabla9 wrote: post #13

New animated ads and videos in the street are just horrible. Eyes follow movement automatically. You have to consciously avert you gaze constantly to not look into them. Two hours in the city and you start feeling tired from the cognitive load and the resistance towards impulse buy decreases a little. * Walking on the street looking down is the only defense in the streets. * Online only ad-blockers keep you sane.

The book 'The Space Merchants' (1952) from Frederik Pohl and Cyril M. Kornbluth describes this type world. World is run by ad companies (FB, Google,...) who select political leaders. People have to be careful on the street not to be trapped by highly aggressive ads.

In fiction I also liked Richard K Morgan's take on holographic advertising in Altered Carbon.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#266

Post by infogulch » Thu, Jan 16, 2020, 12:44 AM UTC

bluntfang wrote: post #246

infogulch wrote: post #140

Advertising is an attack on your psyche. Its very existence is an assumption that you should be dissatisfied with your life, and any advertising 'tricks' (only showing happy, beautiful people using it etc, aka 95% of the content of most advertisements) beyond purely factual statements about the product are explicitly designed to hijack every possible unconscious bias in their target audience to make them want it. Sur…

>you can pretty easily analyze and counteract the effect. How? From my previous research I've found that it's one of those things that even if you know you're being tricked, it still affects your decision making.

I agree, but I've seen people insist otherwise. s/can pretty easily/may be able to/ is more reasonable I guess, but the point of that sentence is that even if you can perfectly counter it, can you do it perfectly forever?

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#267

Post by pascalxus » Thu, Jan 16, 2020, 12:51 AM UTC

mayniac wrote: post #247

pascalxus wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your might be right about most people. (advertisers love to tell this to their CEO but they've been wrong about this before - just look at the 20 million dollar case study with Ebay and their wasted ad spend on google ads). But, it really doesn't work on me 99.9% of the time. I know because I review all my spending habits and I can clearly see 1/2 of the products I buy don't even advertise. Ever seen an ad for cucumb…

I doubt the only products you buy are cucumbers, tomatoes and gas. You've chosen your phone, laptop, car, and various other branded items. Advertising very likely played a role in your decisions there. How can you actually be sure that advertising doesn't work on you? Of course, you don't see an ad on TV for a new smart fridge and immediately jump out of your sofa, wallet in hand, to go buy it. But the key thing is t…

I'm not your typical consumer. I buy the cheapest thing of each category unless there's an overwhelming reason not to. Computer: macbook pro (not because of ads but because I had to in order to develop for apple products), phone: Iphone - got it for free as a handme down from my wife. Very few of the groceries I buy have labels on them: it's all fresh fruit, veggies, things from the bulk section, almost nothing in the grocery store I've bought is advertised. I don't eat processed food or any kind of food that comes in a box or prepackaged bag. When my fridge breaks down I will buy the cheapest fridge I can find unless there's data that shows some fridges are more reliable than others. I buy maybe 2 pairs of pants per decade, and when I do buy clothes it's usually at used clothing store, and I don't pay any attention to what the label says other than the size and type of material.

Brand almost never ever comes into my decision making process. that's why its so hard for me to believe. I buy the cheaper one every time unless there's overwhelming reason not to. Frankly, I don't understand how this isn't the default behaviour for everyone.

The only areas where advertising works on me is on the following (when they actually give me information about products I actually want): occassionally on movies (but even then it's a small percentage ~ most of the time i get whatevers i find on fandango ~ i've even missed some movies i wanted to watch because the ads didn't reach me or I forgot), occassionally the restaurant coupons (half price), metromile, maybe banking (since that actually does require trust) .

Metromile is wasting their money by retargetting me. I'll leave the second I find another insurance that's cheaper - I have absolutely 0 brand loyalty for almost everything. If anything, they're just reminding me to check around for cheaper services that may pop up.

Utility bills -> no choice therefore ads don't matter. Housing -> found on zillow . Zillow itself, someone told me about it (not advertisement).

phone plan - i really had to hunt to find usmobile - 8$/month for 100 minutes, 100 messages. I can't even imagine how much money the telecom industry has squandered on me without any effect at all.

ISP - At&t hits me ads all the time, and everytime I'm just reminded about how evil they are and I check around to see if there's any other better broadband providers besides the one I'm using right now. so their ads are actually having the opposite of the desired effect, same with comcast.

The reason all these ads don't affect me is because they all appeal to Emotion and unverifiable information. And that's not how I generally make my decisions.

For example, when at&t says they have the best network, that's completely useless to me because I can't verify that it's true, or at least it's hard to do so.

Because most ads appeal based on emotion and I don't use emotion to make my buying decisions, it means they simply don't work.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#268

Post by asdff » Thu, Jan 16, 2020, 12:52 AM UTC

musingsole wrote: post #255

tvanantwerp wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never understood how billboards are acceptable. A giant sign that screams "Look at me, not the road!" seems like a bad idea.

Particularly when areas have laws about cellphone use while driving.

especially ironic when the billboard is an advert about not texting while driving.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#269

Post by asdff » Thu, Jan 16, 2020, 12:56 AM UTC

slumdev wrote: post #202

pascalxus wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These stories are so common, when I read it, I was thinking it was a precise description of my own brother. My brother who earns 6 times less than I purchases a 1000$ Samsung phone whereas I don't buy any phone at all and just use the handme-down from my wife, for 0$. It's a 5 year old iphone6 but still works Great. His other expenses are much lower though: for example, he has subsidized housing which means he pays a…

What's frightening is that advertising does work on all of us, even when we find it offensive. I buy warehouse store house-brand laundry detergent, but if you put me on Family Feud and asked me to name a detergent brand, it'd be Tide.

I call everything by the name brand, but only buy the store brand.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#270

Post by asdff » Thu, Jan 16, 2020, 12:59 AM UTC

UnFleshedOne wrote: post #259

nabla9 wrote: post #13

New animated ads and videos in the street are just horrible. Eyes follow movement automatically. You have to consciously avert you gaze constantly to not look into them. Two hours in the city and you start feeling tired from the cognitive load and the resistance towards impulse buy decreases a little. * Walking on the street looking down is the only defense in the streets. * Online only ad-blockers keep you sane.

Rugged screens that can be built right into pavement are coming I'm sure.

Waiting for unskippable ads that pause if you take your eyes off the screen. The tech is already there now that we all have face scanners in our cellphones.