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Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

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Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#261

Post by jaabe »

sandGorgon wrote: post #182

Can someone from the Google team comment on what's going on - https://techcrunch.com/2019/05/07/kotlin-is-now-googles-pref... > Android development will become increasingly Kotlin-first,” Google writes in today’s announcement https://techcrunch.com/2019/05/07/google-launches-jetpack-co... > Google today announced the first preview of Jetpack Compose, a new open-source UI toolkit for Kotlin developers who want to use…

If you want to do android development, Kotlin.

If you want to do multi platform development, flutter.

I think flutter will be an amazing tool for smaller teams, especially in non-tech-primary organisations. I work in the public sector of Denmark, we do in-house development, our main focus is the public services we provide though. So there is just no way we can do mobile, desktop and web without something like Flutter, or severely increased funding. The latter won’t happen, but flutter might.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#262

Post by tracker1 »

la_fayette wrote: post #253
rohan1024 wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> all of them cause more problem than they solve I know what you mean. But have you tried flutter? Try it and you might change your opinion just like me.

I tried flutter. The available plugins cannot compete with the cordova or react native plugin system. For most apps a PWA or cordova-based web app is enough... Many apps are data-intensive and don't require fancy animations... My clients are more than happy with what the web has to offer.

That's mostly my opinion as well... Your better off with a mostly portable web based codebase, or dedicated or hybrid apps. Say what you will of Facebook, their ux approach with react send the most pragmatic.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#263

Post by rattray »

jaabe wrote: post #261
sandGorgon wrote: post #182

Can someone from the Google team comment on what's going on - https://techcrunch.com/2019/05/07/kotlin-is-now-googles-pref... > Android development will become increasingly Kotlin-first,” Google writes in today’s announcement https://techcrunch.com/2019/05/07/google-launches-jetpack-co... > Google today announced the first preview of Jetpack Compose, a new open-source UI toolkit for Kotlin developers who want to use…

If you want to do android development, Kotlin. If you want to do multi platform development, flutter. I think flutter will be an amazing tool for smaller teams, especially in non-tech-primary organisations. I work in the public sector of Denmark, we do in-house development, our main focus is the public services we provide though. So there is just no way we can do mobile, desktop and web without something like Flutter…

Why not React / React Native?

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#264

Post by pjmlp »

mindentropy wrote: post #250
pjmlp wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Internal politic wars at Google, with management having popcorns to see who wins at the end. If you are confortable with Qt, JavaFX, Xamarin, there is hardly anything to see with Flutter, plus they are based on programming languages that you actually want to have on your CV, instead of one that was dropped from Chrome and rescued at last minute by AdWords team. Plus, even Fuchsia is not so focused on Flutter anylonge…

For embedded devices the only good toolkit is Qt and the licensing costs are pretty high. Flutter for embedded is interesting in this regard.

Gluon, PTC and Aicas also license JavaFX.

Qt licensing costs are quite standard to market prices of similar products.

Also if one doesn't want to pay for Qt, it is free to do themselves the same they want to do with upstream developers.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#265

Post by tracker1 »

tylerhou wrote: post #209
chupasaurus wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

s/Fuschia/Fuchsia/ And also it hints that you don't know what are you writing about. > You can write desktop apps in a zillion different languages and Frameworks after all. You can but the portability would be an issue. Each major OS has their own set of API/ABI, vastly different from each other, and Fuchsia isn't an exemption. You can write with QT for desktops but it wouldn't work on mobiles, you can write for Elec…

> s/Fuschia/Fuchsia/ And also it hints that you don't know what are you writing about. Is this necessary? Also, you definitely shouldn't be throwing stones while living in a glass house. s/mobiles/mobile > You can but the portability would be an issue. Each major OS has their own set of API/ABI, vastly different from each other, and Fuchsia isn't an exemption. You can write with QT for desktops but it wouldn't work o…

Aside: Would love to see electron and Cordova bridge the gap together for mobile targets. If they can establish a few common interop libraries, you could come very close to the same code for both.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#266

Post by ericathegreat »

d0100 wrote: post #94

Flash is back

And that's a genuinely great thing.

Sure, by the end Flash was a pain in everyone's backside. But Flash was critical in the transformation from a text-only internet to one where we could watch videos, or play games, or chat to other people in real time. So much of our modern web standards were born from an attempt to make it possible to do the things that Flash taught us should be possible.

If Flutter can be half as transformative as Flash was, then bring it on!

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#267

Post by tracker1 »

zackbrown wrote: post #120
michaelchisari wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, but (unfortunately) it's hardly an outlier in today's ecosystem.

Try importing `flutter/animation` — footprint goes WAY off the deep end. `animation.ddc.js` is 4.4MB alone (unminified), never mind the rest of the runtime AND userland application code. You can see this in the flutter_web/examples/gallery example. [`webdev build` failed for me in examples/gallery, so I'd love to see what a successfully minified version of that example looks like — I'm currently deeply skeptical.] Co…

And here I am freaking about an uncompressed js payload of 300k for an entire app... 4+MB just feels crazy.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#268

Post by bsaul »

sandGorgon wrote: post #228
zengid wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't mean to be cynical, but the answer may be 'whichever language wins'. Maybe Google wants to support Dart because its built in-house, while simultaneously supporting Kotlin because it is so well loved by developers. Just a guess.

No. Mobile Dev is not anything close to web dev : developers don't have control of run time devices. Google is now mandating 64 bit APK for its apps (after years and years of trying) - that's a end device support issue. React native has had 64 bit problems for years. Viewmodel is a lifecycle aware component. Android Q will come with foldable-aware SDK. Will that be supported both on Dart & AndroidX/Kotlin ? Someone h…

As a developer you cannot expect that the technology you learned at university will be used forever ( or actually at all) in your professional life. Schools are supposed to teach you enough of the fundamentals to be able to adapt and learn the tech du jour on your own.

The sooner your students learn that lesson the better.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#269

Post by tracker1 »

saagarjha wrote: post #88
westoque wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t understand the obsession with small binaries and compiled packages. I care about usability and user experience. If it takes 5mb to have a smooth experience then I’m all for it. It’s funny how we now have fiber having 1GB/s internet speeds and we rant about having 1MB size package being too big. Also, everyone’s moving to 4k now with even bigger transfer/data requirements. tldr; 1mb should be a non issue as lo…

> It’s funny now that there’s fiber having 1GB/s internet speeds, we rant about 1MB size package. Half the people in the world probably struggle to have access to a 10 Mb/s connection. Even I go to places with connections that are tenuous at best.

It's not just the transfer... It's the compile, load and perceived speed. 1mb compressed and gzipped can be a hundred MB parsed and in memory. Which isn't bad on a modern mid level desktop, but it's crazy on a lower end smart phone.

There are also other factors to consider. I'm not huge in premature optimization, but damn.

Re: Flutter: a Portable UI Framework for Mobile, Web, Embedded, and Desktop

#270

Post by akadeb »

Illniyar wrote: post #259

This is the example flutter app for the web - https://www.nytimes.com/games/prototype/kenken#/ This is flash. You can't do anything in it that fills like the web - no copy paste, right clicking causes things to happen. I don't expect games like this to have links and proper bookmarkable urls, but I doubt it'll work as expected if it did. This is the epitome of the problem with flutter - it re-implements the UI, creat…

Thanks for sharing this link. I have been an avid Sudoku fan and am really glad I found Ken-Ken
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