Earlier quoted context omitted.
I disagree. People who care about not hitting 8.8.8.8 simply do not own a Chromecast.
I own one and have bought three. Cloudflare DNS for me (via a Pihole).
are you internally masquerading 8.8.8.8 to 1.1.1.1?
My Chromecast Ultra would not start until I began answering 8.8.8.8
261–270 of 519 posts
Re: My Chromecast Ultra would not start until I began answering 8.8.8.8
#262Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, but how does it help hardcoding one IP address that ISPs can simply route to their own DNS server?
Today the ISP could, with a bunch of effort, re-route the traffic, though I haven't seen any evidence that any of them do that. So it helps materially because for today it works. Tomorrow these devices will do DPRIV, probably DNS over HTTPS, and so the ISP won't be different from any other man-in-the-middle, unable to meddle with the contents of protected traffic.
It's quite common in the UK: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_blocking_in_the_United_Kin...
My ISP does the blocking slightly - the DNS response is fine, but they inject a redirect into the HTTP response.
Re: My Chromecast Ultra would not start until I began answering 8.8.8.8
#263Earlier quoted context omitted.
I disagree. People who care about not hitting 8.8.8.8 simply do not own a Chromecast.
Not really, before you could firewall it off from the rest of your network - though now you can just masquerade 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4 to your DNS server of choice
Until Google implements DNS over TLS and does cert checking.
Re: My Chromecast Ultra would not start until I began answering 8.8.8.8
#264It's not new, and but limited to Chromecast Ultra, I detected this from several Android devices (phones) pre-Pie and configured my firewall to redirect those requests to my own DNS. Regardless of their reason, many of us don't want to use Google DNS and the just using their control over these devices to force people to 8.8.8.8/8.8.4.4. I haven't checked how Pie behaves yet but it provides an option in the UI to speci…
Google's business is built on web services, and we know for a fact that ISP occasionally try to inject bullshit into their customers browsing sessions via all kinds of dirty tricks. Their DNS is also designed to be faster than typical DNS. I wouldn't be surprised if Google sees this as a way to ensure the proper function of their devices.
I suspect it's to keep people from using Pi-holes or other DNS level adblockers. A non-ultra chromecast will totally ignore the routers preferred DNS unless you blackhole 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4, then it'll fallback to the DNS server you actually want it to use.
Re: My Chromecast Ultra would not start until I began answering 8.8.8.8
#265Jared Mauch's response was pretty rude. I don't mind defaults, but I do not like the inability to change. I wonder if it was clearly documented as a device requirement that 8.8.8.8 was needed. All prerequisites of function should be in the Quick Start Guide of the tool in question. Furthermore, users aren't always in control of the firewall/ACL on their network. If I go to Jack's Organic Coffee for a meeting and they…
Maybe I'm missing the forest for the trees but... what possible reason would you have for taking a Chromecast to a coffee shop?
The problem here is you are falling in the same trap as the Google engineers here.
Why would ______ want to do _______ with their ______ device?
You can make a locked down device that only does a very limited subset of functions, but you really should make that known to the user before hand. "This device requires access to $X servers to function".
If you have secret requirements that go far beyond user expectations, expect that your users might get pissy about it.
Re: My Chromecast Ultra would not start until I began answering 8.8.8.8
#266Yeah. I know we'd all want to believe that the response and reaction here would be the same if it was pointed to 1.1.1.1, but... yeah, we know better. Everyone would point out that consumer ISPs server polluted data and that Cloudflare clearly provides better service, and relying on that instead of the local garbage is quite obviously a benefit to the device user. But this is Google, and people here have iPhones, so…
It's not unreasonable to attempt to use DHCP provided DNS servers. It's not unreasonable to use fallback DNS servers when the DHCP provided servers don't work. It would be a bit strange, but maybe not altogether unreasonable to run a fully recursive DNS client with root.hints and what not. I guess you could argue over reasonableness of favoring the fallback DNS over DHCP. It's not reasonable to ignore DHCP when the f…
> It's not unreasonable to use fallback DNS servers when the DHCP provided servers don't work.
I don't know about "reasonable" or "unreasonable". I do know that there's no way I'd allow this in my network. My DHCP servers point to my own DNS server for a good reason, and I am completely invested in ensuring that nobody bypasses it to the best of my ability.
Re: My Chromecast Ultra would not start until I began answering 8.8.8.8
#267Earlier quoted context omitted.
It doesn't bother me because it's a Chromecast, an appliance I don't want or need. If I needed something similar, I could get it from other manufacturers.
FWIW, Chrome does this as well. Its DNS prefetch feature will ignore your local hosts file and configured DNS servers. It creates annoying problems if you have a VPN where some hosts resolve differently than they do publicly. Granted, in this case if you block Google's DNS servers from routing, Chrome will use your system's name resolution configuration.
TIL! This upsets me more than the Chromecast using Google's DNS.
I barely use Chrome anymore (just for testing really) but the thought that any domain I wish to go to can be overridden by the browser by default - that's scary.
I mean what if Google doesn't like your website's content. They can block it on their DNS server and 99.999% of Chrome users would think something was wrong with your site.
Thank you, I hate it.
Re: My Chromecast Ultra would not start until I began answering 8.8.8.8
#268Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm not arguing with that, but lots of us can and do run our own DNS for various reasons, it should respect that, or provide a power-user way to override the default DNS. By all means offer fall-backs to Google DNS if it's not behaving correctly, for the reason you mention. I've found it's also, quite poorly implemented, particular on CC Audios, I had an instance last year where my internet connection went down at my…
DNAT
At least until Google starts DNS over TLS with cert pinning.
Re: My Chromecast Ultra would not start until I began answering 8.8.8.8
#269This should bother people here more than it does. The last thing the Internet needs is even more dependence upon Google. They've made it quite clear through their actions that they're not supporters of a free and open Internet: https://theintercept.com/2018/09/14/google-china-prototype-l... If people don't push back against these kinds of things, Google will continue to abuse their power. There shouldn't be an army o…
The last thing the Internet needs is even more dependence upon Google Watching Big G's actions over the last few years, I've sometimes wondered if it's laying the groundwork to fork the internet. People talk about China and Russia's actions balkanizing the internet. But I have a sense that Google could do it, as well, and bring us back to the days when people didn't know the difference between the real internet and A…
> I've sometimes wondered if it's laying the groundwork to fork the internet.
Would that mean that my internet would no longer have Googly stuff on it? I could get behind that.
Re: My Chromecast Ultra would not start until I began answering 8.8.8.8
#270Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Or is there a legitimate usecase for such behaviour? Yes, to track you better.
Or to speed up the Internet experience. https://googleblog.blogspot.com/2009/12/introducing-google-p...
There's so much latency already with the chromecast. how much difference does a few tens of milliseconds make?