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I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

triplebyte.com

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Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#261

Post by btilly »

dunpeal wrote: post #240
btilly wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that "junior interviewers" are not necessarily junior, just junior as interviewers. They may be good coders, but they don't know what is reasonable to expect for the role, or how to test for it. Furthermore coding questions stop being quantifiable and objective as soon as you add in, "What feedback do you give, when, and how?" Two interviewers asking the same question of equivalent candidates can get very differ…

> Note that "junior interviewers" are not necessarily junior, just junior as interviewers. Sure, but these are highly correlated. If you've been working in startups for a few years, you will have some experience in both coding and interviewing coders. Even most of the successful large companies are pretty good at cultivating interviewing skills among their employees. > Furthermore coding questions stop being quantifi…

Sure, but these are highly correlated. If you've been working in startups for a few years, you will have some experience in both coding and interviewing coders.

Even most of the successful large companies are pretty good at cultivating interviewing skills among their employees.

I would put it the other way around.

My experience is that most startups just put you in front of people and tell you to figure it out. People who have done that for a bit wind up with really bad interview habits because they never get corrected. My experience with large companies (Google and Amazon) has them giving interview training. I learned a lot more about interviewing from that than the informal practice that I got in startups.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#262

Post by throwaway080383 »

dunpeal wrote: post #185
jorblumesea wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most engineering interviewees fail to advance because of cultural/personality/communication issues and not technical competence. The amount of people I've washed out of the interview process because they've gone on some rant about windows vs linux, political ideology or just came off as unable to communicate in general. This is also the hardest to communicate as it is something inherent to the candidate. It's not per…

> Most engineering interviewees fail to advance because of cultural/personality/communication issues and not technical competence. Not my experience. At least when hiring for programming positions, the typical fatal issue is that the candidate's coding is weak. In my first role as a hiring manager, I didn't stress coding tests for candidates with long work history on their resume. Since then, I learned better. I've s…

I also learned this not long after I started conducting coding interviews. People with resumes from the best schools and the best companies would fail in multiple interviews in a row. Nowadays I don't even look at the resume, though to be fair I am only tasked with evaluating coding ability, and not things like culture fit or pay scale.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#263

Post by mixmastamyk »

dunpeal wrote: post #185
jorblumesea wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most engineering interviewees fail to advance because of cultural/personality/communication issues and not technical competence. The amount of people I've washed out of the interview process because they've gone on some rant about windows vs linux, political ideology or just came off as unable to communicate in general. This is also the hardest to communicate as it is something inherent to the candidate. It's not per…

> Most engineering interviewees fail to advance because of cultural/personality/communication issues and not technical competence. Not my experience. At least when hiring for programming positions, the typical fatal issue is that the candidate's coding is weak. In my first role as a hiring manager, I didn't stress coding tests for candidates with long work history on their resume. Since then, I learned better. I've s…

They can't code because you are looking figuratively over their shoulder---the clock is ticking next to a hundred grand in a suitcase.

A single question is pulled from subjects vast enough to fill up years of college and there is no time to research, as one would in the real world. Binary pass/fail with your pride/livelyhood/family on the line.

Please state your last exam conducted under such conditions?

Oh and your questions probably stink. I've gotten plenty of them with recursion that might take ten minutes in seclusion but simply not possible under the gun.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#264

Post by matz1 »

mrkurt wrote: post #182
btilly wrote: post #141

I believe that the article is fundamentally wrong. The bulk of the article is true. But companies are not lying when they say that legal risk is a reason not to send feedback. Triplebyte is in the unusual position of being able to say, "Everyone who has enough technical skill gets through the interview." And that fact is sufficient to defuse their risk. But real companies don't have the luxury of ignoring non-technic…

"Can't understand their accent" _is_ discriminatory. Please don't ever recommend against a candidate for that. Companies are definitely taking the easy way out. The reality is that most of them don't have a good hiring process, aren't consistent about hiring decisions, and tend to choose based on factors that have nothing to do with the job they're hiring for.

Yes, It is discriminatory. So ? Not able to code is also discriminatory to someone who don't know how to code.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#265

Post by wst_ »

btilly wrote: post #141

I believe that the article is fundamentally wrong. The bulk of the article is true. But companies are not lying when they say that legal risk is a reason not to send feedback. Triplebyte is in the unusual position of being able to say, "Everyone who has enough technical skill gets through the interview." And that fact is sufficient to defuse their risk. But real companies don't have the luxury of ignoring non-technic…

Just say he's no fit for the organization. Safe and at least partially fair for the candidates.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#266

Post by brendonjohn »

I don't think a company should offer an interview if they're not willing to give proper feedback at the end of it.

When interviewing candidates, I have been more than happy to give detailed feedback if they've asked me to give it. I realise it's unconventional, so I get the feedback peer reviewed before sending it away. I'm pleased to see that there are other companies learning how to give better feedback.

Giving feedback is a small token of respect that a company can give in return for a candidates time.

In my experience, interviewees have been thankful and shared how hard it is to get feedback from their interviewers.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#267

Post by shady-lady »

michaelt wrote: post #153
tptacek wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is harder to build a work-sample regimen than to just send candidates to interviewers, sure. But then, the point of Triplebyte is that they're eating all that work for you. Regarding "fleets of laptops" and environments and all that jazz: these seem like unforced obstacles. Just have the candidates use their own machines. Here's a crazy idea: have them use their own offices/couches, too. Regarding security practic…

Just have the candidates use their own machines. We tried inviting candidates to bring their own laptops, and it turns out often they didn't _have_ laptops - or we'd tell them there was a Java-based test and (perhaps due to a miscommunication or because this is an uncommon interview practice) they'd arrive with a laptop without a working Java VM or compiler. Needless to say, you can't objectively compare two candidat…

> Needless to say, you can't objectively compare two candidates' progress if one of them spends half the interview trying to get their environment set up!

If most of the issues revolve around having roughly the same environment for candidates, just create ready to go VM images, for example VirtualBox, and share that with them. Or use a cloud desktop VM.

All of which make it easier for someone to succeed.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#268

Post by icedchai »

stone-monkey wrote: post #181
icedchai wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Naming a specific person is not nice, but still not "doxxing."

That's exactly what doxxing is.(Paraphrasing here) "This guy was really shitty in my job interview. Here's their LinkedIn page." Seemed pretty cut and dry to me. What about it disqualified it as a not-doxxing situation?

"Doxxing", in the original sense, involves publishing more private info, info like address, home phone, cell phone, SSN, etc. A link to someones public LinkedIn page is not a "dox."

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#269

Post by jonny_eh »

munchbunny wrote: post #183
btilly wrote: post #141

I believe that the article is fundamentally wrong. The bulk of the article is true. But companies are not lying when they say that legal risk is a reason not to send feedback. Triplebyte is in the unusual position of being able to say, "Everyone who has enough technical skill gets through the interview." And that fact is sufficient to defuse their risk. But real companies don't have the luxury of ignoring non-technic…

I think your point that the actual companies have to judge culture fit is critical. TripleByte's interview is about as purely technical as you can get. Their promise to client companies is that the candidates who pass are technically sound to a baseline level. That leaves the companies to judge cultural fit, which is where all of that legal liability seeps in. I've done the TripleByte interview before. Even got an of…

I agree 100%. I recommend that anyone who gives engineering interviews, especially phone screens, to go through the Triplebyte process.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#270

Post by gnicholas »

wst_ wrote: post #265
btilly wrote: post #141

I believe that the article is fundamentally wrong. The bulk of the article is true. But companies are not lying when they say that legal risk is a reason not to send feedback. Triplebyte is in the unusual position of being able to say, "Everyone who has enough technical skill gets through the interview." And that fact is sufficient to defuse their risk. But real companies don't have the luxury of ignoring non-technic…

Just say he's no fit for the organization. Safe and at least partially fair for the candidates.

Interestingly, if they give concrete technical reasons why people weren't hired in most cases, then telling some people that they were "not a fit" could actually raise a red flag.

Basically, it tells them that there was no technical reason not to hire them, which raises the question of whether it was something illegitimate.

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