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Xi: an editor for the next 20 years [video]

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Re: Xi: an editor for the next 20 years [video]

#261
post #239

Never I would have guessed that "xi" is pronounces "gsai". I would pronounce it "shee" (like chinese) or "ksai" (english) or "ksee" (german). Also, I don't thin we need another editor with a pluggable focus. It's not true that you need plugins to a text editor. It is plugged into an environment that also contains all the other things you need. It interacts via "open file", "read file", "write file" and "close file" w…

Almost every English word that starts with an X has a "z" sound. e.g. xenon, xylophone, xiphoid. In fact, I can't think of any exceptions. "zigh" as a pronunciation seems natural to me.

Yeah, but when you ask a Chinese person how to pronounce Xi or Xiu the X -> sh. That's why I went with Shee also when I read this.

Re: Xi: an editor for the next 20 years [video]

#262
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I must concur. With an equivalent vim setup and code files, nothing beats X11/suckless terminal on my OpenBSD machine. Comparing to that, even Alacritty looks like a slug. I must say however that things are looking a bit better in iTerm2 when switching the Metal renderer on. It's just a shame that an Nvidia GPU on OSX is necessary to compete with my $1000 Lenovo with its crappy Intel chip on OpenBSD when it comes to…

Have you tested iTerm2's Metal renderer performance with the integrated Intel GPU?

Yes, however matter-of-factly while moving about the office. I did not perceive any difference between the Mac plugged in and on the go.

Re: Xi: an editor for the next 20 years [video]

#264
post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Text editors shouldn't have a "core" and "front end" and "protocol". Monolithic machine executable that fits into under a meg of RAM and comes up in a fraction of a second from a cold invocation.

Yes, they should. And here is why: 1. Stability. I'm writing my own editor at the moment, and the text buffers are kept in a server process. Last time I updated the server process it'd been running continuously for a month despite extensive reworking of the frontend. The backed is trivially simple (~300 lines), and easy to keep stable. If the frontend crashes it doesn't take my open buffers with it. 2. Coming up in a…

Even as part of the minority that use window managers on linux I find the idea of merely using the window manager exclusively in place of other forms of UI for multiple documents/pages/buffers within a gui app as fantastically underwhelming.

Lets look at firefox as an example. The fact that a vertical tabbar is more useful in this case due to screen shape and size and it being useful to be able to read a bit more of the text when you have a lot of tabs. This could in theory by done by your wm even though I've not seen one that does. Further tree style tabs shows a visual hierarchy of sorts that can't be replicated by your wm because it doesn't know what link was opened from what. Further you can perform operations on groups of tabs, like closing them, bookmarking them, reloading them. Its difficult to see how your wm could infer this hierarchy and how it could allow application specific operations like bookmarking even if it could. Further its useful to sometimes open a number of links in the background before switching to any of the above. This is trivially effected within the browser but challenging outside of it because the action of opening a link happens inside the browser.

Within my irc client various channels are arranged according to network and color coded according to activity. Right clicking on individual channels or networks allows specific actions regarding those networks or channels. None of the above would work with a bunch of stacked/tabbed windows.

I could make a list for emacs but the complaint is the same wm ends up being an unfixably poorer alternative to dealing with multiple documents in the app.

I use i3wm not because its awesome at managing multiple documents but because its simple and straightforward and 90% of workspaces, which span only a single monitor, have only 1-2 windows on them. Rarely 3 or 4 and never more.

Window managers are just unfixably mediocre in this respect because the UI doesn't have access to context and can't differ based on use.

Re: Xi: an editor for the next 20 years [video]

#265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you tried Terminal.app recently? A lot of people seem to rush immediately to iTerm2... And I used to be one of those, a few years back. But eventually I gave the built-in Terminal.app a serious chance and found it met all my requirements. Although I also stopped customizing my theme, and I keep as many defaults as possible. SF Mono is a great font!

I did the same thing a few years ago. Terminal.app has had tab support for years now. What's the killer feature of iTerm these days? I also recall finding Terminal.app to have lower CPU consumption, matching postit's experience.

I really like the tmux integration.

Re: Xi: an editor for the next 20 years [video]

#266
post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Text editors shouldn't have a "core" and "front end" and "protocol". Monolithic machine executable that fits into under a meg of RAM and comes up in a fraction of a second from a cold invocation.

Yes, they should. And here is why: 1. Stability. I'm writing my own editor at the moment, and the text buffers are kept in a server process. Last time I updated the server process it'd been running continuously for a month despite extensive reworking of the frontend. The backed is trivially simple (~300 lines), and easy to keep stable. If the frontend crashes it doesn't take my open buffers with it. 2. Coming up in a…

If you want stability, the way you do that is "do not write your own editor at the moment, or any other moment".

Re: Xi: an editor for the next 20 years [video]

#267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Keep in mind a lot of less-sophisticated users will just mash navigation keys (or click-drag the scrollbar) instead of using more sophisticated navigation commands. If high-speed scrolling isn't reasonably optimized, it will be noticed.

Yeah also I recently tried Xi-mac and the first thing I did to see how fast it was was to drag the scroll bar quickly. Based on my experience of other editors that is where they usually get slow (no editor seriously has problems inserting one character at a time). Unfortunately Xi was quite laggy in the scrolling department. Slower than VSCode for example.

Were you perhaps on a debug build? This would be quite surprising in a release build.

Re: Xi: an editor for the next 20 years [video]

#268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm at least twice as likely to hit "emacs -nw" for a quick edit than launch the GUI version. I think that alone marks you as an unusual emacs user; the standard pattern for using emacs is to leave it running all the time (either in a window, or as a dæmon), not to launch new instances. But yes, it would be interesting to have numbers. > Being useful in a terminal is a critical requirement for me. Oh, certainly; in…

What do you find that achieves for you that an X11 emacs running a server doesn't? I have EDITOR set to emacsclient (and some other aliases) and I find it far more convenient than an in-terminal editor, especially when combined with sudoedit.

> What do you find that achieves for you that an X11 emacs running a server doesn't?

I only use it for quick edits to files, when I don't want to turn my head from my terminal to my emacs window. Yeah, it's just a bit lazy …

Re: Xi: an editor for the next 20 years [video]

#269

Pragmatically speaking the issue with switching editors is the fact that if it is not emacs or vi it is not a default install on whatever you sit down at. I have tried tons of editors, and I always come back to vim. Heck, I have even moved my .vimrc to be the simplest possible with the smallest number of plugins.

If i'm understanding things correctly you could write a vi/vim compatible frontend for xi so you get the benefits while not losing the functionality or muscle memory when not using xi.

Re: Xi: an editor for the next 20 years [video]

#270
post #9

Xi creator did an amazing work implementing ropes ( https://github.com/google/xi-editor/tree/master/rust/rope ) The design documents ( https://github.com/google/xi-editor/tree/master/doc/rope_sci... ) explaining the concepts and implementation details is a must for those who want to understand its core. But I still have my regards regarding input latency being accredited only to the text editor. I recently switched b…

Have you tried Terminal.app recently? A lot of people seem to rush immediately to iTerm2... And I used to be one of those, a few years back. But eventually I gave the built-in Terminal.app a serious chance and found it met all my requirements. Although I also stopped customizing my theme, and I keep as many defaults as possible. SF Mono is a great font!

Terminal with GNU Screen works really well for me.
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