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Ask HN: Women in tech, how do you find non-toxic work environments?

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Re: Ask HN: Women in tech, how do you find non-toxic work environments?

#261

Post by opo »

WillPostForFood wrote: post #239
treehau5 wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bullshit. nobody wanted open floor plans, or if they did, they had immediate buyers remorse. Open floor plans became a fad that turned into a way for cheap ass companies to slash costs and brag about it on linkedin about how trendy they were being.

I can prove you wrong. I want and like open floor plans, and have never had buyer's remorse. I'll rule out any cube farm for any future job; I hate the isolation.

It is unfortunate that companies can't be flexible and give employees the environment that the employees find will make them more productive. So one group of people could be seated elbow to elbow with headphones to avoid some of the distractions and another group of people would have personal offices with a door where they can concentrate - that way everyone is happy.

Re: Ask HN: Women in tech, how do you find non-toxic work environments?

#262

Post by [deleted] »

WillPostForFood wrote: post #239
treehau5 wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bullshit. nobody wanted open floor plans, or if they did, they had immediate buyers remorse. Open floor plans became a fad that turned into a way for cheap ass companies to slash costs and brag about it on linkedin about how trendy they were being.

I can prove you wrong. I want and like open floor plans, and have never had buyer's remorse. I'll rule out any cube farm for any future job; I hate the isolation.

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Women in tech, how do you find non-toxic work environments?

#263

Post by [deleted] »

treehau5 wrote: post #190
alaskamiller wrote: post #155

Silicon valley culture used to be that way, and is still that way. The cube farms was the prevailing best practice. Then the pendulum swung to the other side with the new kids entering the workforce and wanted open office, work families, and all that. Which then created the cargo culting from others entering the process. Now we're on the bubble of the pendulum swinging back. So it goes.

Bullshit. nobody wanted open floor plans, or if they did, they had immediate buyers remorse. Open floor plans became a fad that turned into a way for cheap ass companies to slash costs and brag about it on linkedin about how trendy they were being.

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Women in tech, how do you find non-toxic work environments?

#264

Post by mythrwy »

seaknoll wrote: post #99

Woman at a ~100 person startup here - Wanted to comment because there are a lot of posts on here that seem to promote some idea that the company has to really push for women-friendly policies/activities to be a great place for women to work, which I happen to completely disagree with (save for policies that could be classified as human-friendly such as leave and flexible hours). I work at a mediocre startup (first en…

You have a very balanced view IMOP.

Re: Ask HN: Women in tech, how do you find non-toxic work environments?

#265

Post by stevenwoo »

If you are open to other locations, I used to work for a NASA contractor near Houston and at that time (when the shuttle was actively used) some of the best programming minds/organization (at least measured by quality/process/number of errors) were the group at Lockheed Martin that made the Shuttle software and I remember it was roughly 50% female from top to bottom. I wonder what became of that group, someone here probably knows the story better than I do. I thought it was SAIC but this article says it was LM.

https://www.fastcompany.com/28121/they-write-right-stuff

When I was there in the early 90's, all the NASA contractors were pretty progressive compared to the stories you read about Silicon Valley today (where I am currently living.)

Re: Ask HN: Women in tech, how do you find non-toxic work environments?

#266

Post by danjoc »

khazhoux wrote: post #177
nostrademons wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I meant it (well, they did...I'm just passing along conclusions) the other way around - having a boss where the wife has a career equal to his is a positive indication, while having one with a stay-at-home wife is a negative indication. The idea is that someone who has chosen to marry and stay married to a career woman is quite literally putting his money where his mouth is when it comes to women's equality: he's mak…

Is there any actual evidence of this?

It's known as a stereotype. "Men who do not have career wives are trouble/red flags/misogynist pigs." Unfortunately, this stereotype appears to be perfectly acceptable on this board.

Re: Ask HN: Women in tech, how do you find non-toxic work environments?

#267

Post by 1123581321 »

danielhooper wrote: post #115
pascalxus wrote: post #53

I'm not a minority, but I think you should be asking this question to everyone, not just minorities. Everyone deserves a non-toxic environment and it's an issue everyone has to deal with. Here's my strategy: Read the glassdoor reviews - If it mentions "people crying at their desks", that's a bad sign - actually any kind of crying in a professional environment is a bad sign. Also, words like "high energy" and "passion…

> I'm not a minority, but I think you should be asking this question to everyone, not just minorities. Everyone deserves a non-toxic environment and it's an issue everyone has to deal with. Hey OP, these are exactly the kind of red flags you should be looking for.

Sorry, but this is one of the worst comments I've read on Hacker News! Its main contention is wrong and expressed in the most unhelpful and toxic way I can imagine.

First, the language on sites like GlassDoor really can offer some insight into how the company intentionally and unintrntionally treats its employees.

But more importantly, when the majority group of employees are working on systemically creating and supporting a fair environment, minority groups of employees do benefit.

Ideally, good workplaces would "just happen," but they don't and the ones that squelch the reforming tendency with toxic language such as you used decrease long-term hiring competitiveness measured across demographics.

Re: Ask HN: Women in tech, how do you find non-toxic work environments?

#268

Post by JimboOmega »

monochromatic wrote: post #214
JimboOmega wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Any place with crap culture is crap culture for almost everyone, no matter gender-identity or race. I can't agree with you. If you work for a company that makes negative assumptions about you because of your gender/race, you'll have a worse experience than when they make positive assumptions. It's about things like when you bring up an idea in a meeting, and it's totally ignored, and the guy across the table brings…

> If you work for a company that makes negative assumptions about you because of your gender/race, you'll have a worse experience than when they make positive assumptions. What's wrong with just not making any assumptions based on gender and race?

Well that's ideal, of course! But I was just pointing out that it's not "all the same" when you're in such an environment.

Re: Ask HN: Women in tech, how do you find non-toxic work environments?

#269

Post by jansho »

goodcanadian wrote: post #207
jansho wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah ok, I was curious to know your opinion since for me, "women-friendly policies" mean consideration for pregnancy, childcare and so on! Regarding diversity events, I slightly disagree with you. Ironically I became an advocate only after my engineering education, when I suddenly experienced 'different' treatment. Welcome to the real world, they say, but it affected me quite badly. I suddenly found those women support…

Ah ok, I was curious to know your opinion since for me, "women-friendly policies" mean consideration for pregnancy, childcare and so on! As a father, it bothers me to see those considerations described as "women-friendly." Why is it assumed that my wife is the one who has to leave early to pick our daughter up from school? The most "woman friendly" policy would also involve changing the expectations on men to allow w…

"Women-friendly policies" don't just cover things like maternity leave. Ultimately they do boil down to "human-friendly policies." How: they accommodate women more and thus balance a culture that's traditionally male-dominated. At least that's the idea.

(I was going to quote seaknoll's comment until I realised that you already mentioned it!)

Re: Ask HN: Women in tech, how do you find non-toxic work environments?

#270

Post by idiotdummy »

danielhooper wrote: post #182
bbcbasic wrote: post #149

A reasoned response is a red flag?

If you have a workplace where women and minorities cannot discuss their issues without a white man butting in to whine "but what about meee?" then yes, that is a toxic work environment.

So "not a minority" means you're a white man?
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