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New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

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Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#261

Post by Klover »

ThrustVectoring wrote: post #247
kyriakos wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Keep in mind that even though unwanted pregnancies could be a problem giving your teenage son this option will also give him the false impression he's immune to STDs which a condom could have prevented.

STD risks are generally overstated. There's basically three practical categories: 1. Herpes. It's usually on the level of "slightly annoying" rather than catastrophic. Pretty much the biggest downside of having herpes is the obligation to tell sexual partners that you have herpes. 2. Things that die to antibiotics. Syphilis, Chlamydia, etc. You get them, you get sick, you get treatment, you get better. 3. HIV/AIDS. T…

>Basically, getting tested regularly is probably enough precaution.

Maybe I'm reading your comment entirely wrong, but this sounds ridiculous? What even is regular testing anyway? I should suddenly be just fine going on tinder or taking men from bars home and not require any condoms, instead just check myself every month and take a bunch of medication if things did go wrong? Or do you mean me and my partner can have sex in our monogamous relationship without condom but instead a regular checkup?

I see the first idea as a terrible idea, and the second as - while safe - a little excessive after the initial checkup when you both are ready for it.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#262

Post by aianus »

TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #71
Broken_Hippo wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish it could go faster, but the truth is this is exactly the sort of thing that should go slowly. It is much better for birth control to have a certain effectiveness, after all. Since this is an injection, probably best to have good tests with longevity as well. It isn't bad to go back every couple years for this, but this is the sort of information one needs to know upfront. Unfortunately, finding this initial st…

A problem in the US is that the company that wants to sell this is the company that needs to pay for the studies required to make it legal. However because it is so cheap, it's difficult for the company to make a profit. The same thing can be found with many supplements. For example, N-acetylcysteine has shown to be helpful in several forms of addiction and mood disorders, but because it is so cheap, no company will…

> However because it is so cheap, it's difficult for the company to make a profit.

Why does it have to be cheap for the consumer? They can charge $5k for this (honestly a bargain) even if the gel and syringe cost $5 to make. Isn't that what patents are for?

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#263

Post by manmal »

nommm-nommm wrote: post #220
manmal wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get it - what does that kind of fairness buy you or society? If it's enough when one side takes contraceptives, what logic argument is there that the other side must do the same? Economically (time, resources, even environmentally; the pill and condoms eventually end up in our water or the sea) this does not make sense.

To minimize the risk of failure. Same reason why you'd have a backup parachute when you jump out of a plane even though you strictly only need one.

Sure, I get that. Grandparent mentioned fairness as driving factor though.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#264

Post by ThrustVectoring »

Klover wrote: post #261
ThrustVectoring wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

STD risks are generally overstated. There's basically three practical categories: 1. Herpes. It's usually on the level of "slightly annoying" rather than catastrophic. Pretty much the biggest downside of having herpes is the obligation to tell sexual partners that you have herpes. 2. Things that die to antibiotics. Syphilis, Chlamydia, etc. You get them, you get sick, you get treatment, you get better. 3. HIV/AIDS. T…

>Basically, getting tested regularly is probably enough precaution. Maybe I'm reading your comment entirely wrong, but this sounds ridiculous? What even is regular testing anyway? I should suddenly be just fine going on tinder or taking men from bars home and not require any condoms, instead just check myself every month and take a bunch of medication if things did go wrong? Or do you mean me and my partner can have…

Default to using a condom, unless your partner has a recent STD test (as measured by your estimate of their number and promiscuity of sexual partners since the STD test). I'm not saying to go to an orgy and have unprotected sex with everyone there.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#265

Post by durkie »

aianus wrote: post #262
TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A problem in the US is that the company that wants to sell this is the company that needs to pay for the studies required to make it legal. However because it is so cheap, it's difficult for the company to make a profit. The same thing can be found with many supplements. For example, N-acetylcysteine has shown to be helpful in several forms of addiction and mood disorders, but because it is so cheap, no company will…

> However because it is so cheap, it's difficult for the company to make a profit. Why does it have to be cheap for the consumer? They can charge $5k for this (honestly a bargain) even if the gel and syringe cost $5 to make. Isn't that what patents are for?

presumably because there are other ways to obtain the active ingredient and bypass a high price.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#266

Post by patrickg_zill »

tptacek wrote: post #260
patrickg_zill wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would point out that you are relying on government statistics for your "poor or jobless" point - and many have pointed out sources of bias that call those stats into question; and also, you are assuming that the Flynn effect will be ongoing rather than just reflecting a topping-up due to better nutrition and more widespread education. Others have calculated that USA/UK have lost as much as 14 IQ points since Victor…

Do you have a more authoritative cite for this than a tabloid article?

In less time than it took you to type this comment, I clicked on the embedded link in the article: https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg22329830-400-brain-dr...

The Richard Lynn they quote, has been published in Nature, amongst many other other publications: http://www.rlynn.co.uk/

The Prof. Woodley they quote, is also a real person: http://www.vub.ac.be/CLEA/cgi-bin/homepage.cgi?email=michael...

As is Jan te Nijenhuis: http://www.uva.nl/en/about-the-uva/organisation/staff-member...

Sorry, but I don't think your comment added anything to the discussion.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#267

Post by Dylan16807 »

orthecreedence wrote: post #237
Dylan16807 wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being wrong about side effects is not the same as being patronizing.

His tone is very "Male contraceptive is ridiculous because it already works just fine for women! Here's some shitty anecdotal evidence to support my claim!" I'd classify that as patronizing, and as a male, I had the same reaction to his comment as the responder...I've known lots of women, partners included, who avoided the pill because of its horrible side effects.

I don't get that tone. He suggested a vasectomy was good too. The critique of this method was only the effectiveness, not that it was unnecessary.

There's a lot wrong in the comment but I don't see what you see in it.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#268

Post by xanderstrike »

earlyriser wrote: post #28

I remember reading about this maybe 6 years ago. What was memorable was that the gel was even cheaper than the syringe. It's sad how slow these things move and that we're not going to have that in North-America for a good time.

It'll be tens of dollars in India but hundreds of dollars here. It would probably be close to the same price to fly to India, have the procedure, and fly home. Plus you get a nice vacation out of it. If this becomes mainstream there I'd do it in a heartbeat, I've always wanted to visit New Delhi.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#269

Post by thelambentonion »

LeftTriangle wrote: post #216
Broken_Hippo wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish it could go faster, but the truth is this is exactly the sort of thing that should go slowly. It is much better for birth control to have a certain effectiveness, after all. Since this is an injection, probably best to have good tests with longevity as well. It isn't bad to go back every couple years for this, but this is the sort of information one needs to know upfront. Unfortunately, finding this initial st…

This kind of thinking is harmfully simplistic. When you rely on rules of thumb ("this sort of thing should go slowly") to make public health decisions, you are going to harm people . In the US, we suffer from an insane degree of regulatory medical conservatism. No one else in the world takes as long to approve life-saving medications as the FDA, and this is not rational ; it's a reflexive political reaction to the Th…

As a quick aside, your source also advocates for free-market healthcare and rejects national healthcare legislation and Medicare under the guise of individual choice.

It has _also_ published such gems as "The Scientific Case against the Global Climate Treaty" and “New Perspectives in Climate Change: What the EPA Isn't Telling Us”.

In light of that, I'll take their advocacy with a grain of salt.

---

On topic, while I can't comment on the EMA specifically, during my (extremely) brief period working alongside a medical device manufacturer, fear of FDA was oftentimes the primary motivating factor in keeping them honest.

While that's entirely anecdotal, when there are _significant_ financial incentives on the table people's morals tend to get more than a little flexible. Pharmaceuticals represent an area with _significant_ financial incentives, and, while I do agree that the FDA takes more time than is strictly necessary, it's a little fallacious to say they "kill vastly more people than they save" through regulation.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#270

Post by [deleted] »

noxToken wrote: post #135
dvdhnt wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's probably difficult because you don't have children and therefore lack the experience necessary to develop a comprehensive understanding of the topic. That's not to say your partial understanding is not valid, it's just incomplete. Not only am I adopted (thus not "wanted"), but neither of my children were planned and my wife and I initially couldn't agree. From my real world experience, and not speculation, it on…

Maybe I'm misreading your comment, but it seems like you're missing the entire point of GP. No one is attempting to cast aside unwanted children. We're trying to prevent conception from happening in the first place for people who are not ready. In this sense, there would be no need for adoption (optimistically speaking), because the only children conceived were done so with intent. It takes out the whole, "Oh crap, I…

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