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Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

recode.net

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Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#261

Post by TheCoelacanth »

myrloc wrote: post #86
rm999 wrote: post #66

Wait a minute... wait. Those service fees I've been opting to pay haven't been going to the shoppers/drivers who are processing my order? On my last order I asked the shopper to specifically go out of her way to check on an out of stock item. I did this with the assumption that my 7 dollar service fee was going directly to her, and that she would therefore be happy to go out of her way. When the delivery person (I th…

The shoppers are not the same as the delivery people. I know this because I have worked as a shopper. While I was working for Instacart, the model of how the drivers/shoppers were tipped or paid was in flux, so I'm not sure what the current model is.

It would be okay if it was split between the driver and the shopper, but Instacart is basically just tricking people into thinking that they are tipping the people serving them when they are actually just giving money to Instacart.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#262

Post by inimino »

The author totally lost me at this point:

"To get to the tip option, customers would have to click on a small arrow to the right of the service fee that doesn’t give any indication where it leads. Even if someone knew to click on that arrow (but honestly, why would they?)"

Seriously?? Has this guy never seen a mobile app before? There is a line reading "Service (10%)" with an actual dollar figure and an arrow pointing to the right. Find me a mobile user who doesn't know what that arrow means. This whole article reads the same way, like the author is just trying to stir up outrage and get page views.

Disclaimer: I have never used Instacart and have no connection with it. Not familiar with Recode either but I am less likely to read anything from them again.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#263

Post by leesalminen »

hfsktr wrote: post #259
leesalminen wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$5 on a $100 bill? In the US? That's awful.

I usually tip % but I don't go to eat at places with such high bills. I can understand the logic though of a fixed tip. There are all kinds of situations where a server spends the same amount of time/effort for each table and get different tips based on what the person ate? Why does that make sense that I would tip more because I got a steak instead of a burger and the server had to just bring it to me in either case…

That is a logical argument and I guess I understand why one would choose that line of thinking.

I guess I tend to eat at the same 3 restaurants around my house. They all know me and are also my neighbors. The social pressure to not be "that guy" has pushed me to tip generously I guess.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#264

Post by TheCoelacanth »

nickez wrote: post #184
Kiro wrote: post #182

Coming from a place where tipping is nonexistent this whole debate feels extremely ancient. I don't understand why a modern country won't just kill off tipping culture.

This is great for everyone! Hopefully they will get a higher salary and I guess the company will pay more in taxes and social benefits (or whatever it is called in English). I don't get how tipping can be legal, or do you actually pay taxes on tips in the US?

> do you actually pay taxes on tips in the US

Yes, they are taxed the same as wages. For tips done via credit/debit card, that will even be reported and have taxes withheld by the employer. For cash tips, the recipient is supposed to report them on their own, though of course, it's fairly common not to report the full amount because it's hard for the government to track.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#265

Post by inimino »

jasonpeacock wrote: post #257
timcederman wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I'd prefer to not pay the service fee, or the tip, but realistically by not doing so you're screwing the delivery folks, who get deliberately underpaid by companies like Instacart. If there was an organized effort, and it was actually sending a message, then great, let's all do it! But really all you're doing is stiffing some poor underpaid delivery person.

Where I live (Seattle) we've passed minimum wage law increases ($15, on a 7yr schedule) that has already resulted in many restaurants adding an automatic & non-optional 20% gratuity to checks, where the fine print says it will be shared between front & back staff. So yes, there's an organized effort and it's making a (slow) difference in shifting the culture of companies under-paying their employees and expecting cus…

How does that work? It seems like raising the minimum wage would make it less necessary for restaurants to add a gratuity, not more.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#266

Post by JoeAltmaier »

inimino wrote: post #262

The author totally lost me at this point: "To get to the tip option, customers would have to click on a small arrow to the right of the service fee that doesn’t give any indication where it leads. Even if someone knew to click on that arrow (but honestly, why would they?)" Seriously?? Has this guy never seen a mobile app before? There is a line reading "Service (10%)" with an actual dollar figure and an arrow pointin…

'Service (10%)' doesn't scream 'Tip' to me. Why on earth not just say 'Tip'?

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#267

Post by wheaties »

inimino wrote: post #262

The author totally lost me at this point: "To get to the tip option, customers would have to click on a small arrow to the right of the service fee that doesn’t give any indication where it leads. Even if someone knew to click on that arrow (but honestly, why would they?)" Seriously?? Has this guy never seen a mobile app before? There is a line reading "Service (10%)" with an actual dollar figure and an arrow pointin…

Once upon a time I made a UI where there were several things. One of them was a gigantic text box with the title "Biography" and another a 2 character wide box with a title "years of experience." We had to change that to a drop down. Why? Read on...

We got a lot of complaints. People couldn't see their resume in the "years of experience" box. Worse they kept getting error messages saying their resume was too long. It was restricted to 2 characters! These same people had glossed over the "biography" box.

So, yes, your ability to reason about a UI and the requisite UX has nothing to do with how others will reason about it. You'll get to learn the hard way like I did.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#268

Post by alex8022 »

inimino wrote: post #265
jasonpeacock wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where I live (Seattle) we've passed minimum wage law increases ($15, on a 7yr schedule) that has already resulted in many restaurants adding an automatic & non-optional 20% gratuity to checks, where the fine print says it will be shared between front & back staff. So yes, there's an organized effort and it's making a (slow) difference in shifting the culture of companies under-paying their employees and expecting cus…

How does that work? It seems like raising the minimum wage would make it less necessary for restaurants to add a gratuity, not more.

The gratuities are usually counted towards the minimum wage, i.e. Hourly wage: 5$/hr, Gratuities: 10$/hr.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#269

Post by strictnein »

inimino wrote: post #265
jasonpeacock wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where I live (Seattle) we've passed minimum wage law increases ($15, on a 7yr schedule) that has already resulted in many restaurants adding an automatic & non-optional 20% gratuity to checks, where the fine print says it will be shared between front & back staff. So yes, there's an organized effort and it's making a (slow) difference in shifting the culture of companies under-paying their employees and expecting cus…

How does that work? It seems like raising the minimum wage would make it less necessary for restaurants to add a gratuity, not more.

They do it instead of raising the prices on their food.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#270

Post by mconzen »

inimino wrote: post #262

The author totally lost me at this point: "To get to the tip option, customers would have to click on a small arrow to the right of the service fee that doesn’t give any indication where it leads. Even if someone knew to click on that arrow (but honestly, why would they?)" Seriously?? Has this guy never seen a mobile app before? There is a line reading "Service (10%)" with an actual dollar figure and an arrow pointin…

If you have actually used the app, you'd understand that the author's point is valid. It is certainly misleading that the "Tip" section (which defaults to 0%) is hidden entirely under the "Service (10%)" line item at checkout, which used to have an arrow but now has a button which says "Edit". Why would you click on a button next to "Service 10%" to find out how to tip, or even know whether tipping is a part of this service model?

It's also unclear how the "Service" fee is distributed. There is an explanation which states that "Unlike a tip, which can only go to the shopper delivering your order, a service amount allows us to pay all shoppers (including those, for example, that also pick out ordered items at the store)".

This implies that it's a "Shared Tips" model as in some restaurants, where tips are distributed evenly amongst the staff that worked that shift. But could also be interpreted that they just collect these "optional" service fees centrally in order to pay all nationwide workers, which simply amounts to corporate revenue unless they are actually distributing 100% of the service fee to Instacart contract employees.

Instacart, as with all "sharing economy" apps, seems to be making quite a bit of corporate revenue on the backs of workers by misleading users.

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