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Shame on Y Combinator

marco.org

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Re: Shame on Y Combinator

#261

Post by prh8 »

maxerickson wrote: post #169
ThomPete wrote: post #127

Marcos understanding of this situation is extremely telling for a fundamental problem with many americans relationship with politics. Most only get involved around election. After that their political interest is non existing. It's easy to get lured into the idea that politics is a simple choice between the moral good and the moral bad, that the choice is simple and that there is a one to one relationship between wha…

I'm pretty sure a huge portion of Trump's support is from people that are essentially single issue tax and supreme court voters (for the presidential election). Or even a Yuuuge portion. Jerry Falwell Jr. isn't struggling or left out of the political process. I also don't understand what everyone have the right to say and mean what they want without having to fear the repercussions is supposed to mean. If someone rep…

I think the idea is that you thinking they are stupid is much different from being fired from a job (or removed as a partner, however you would frame this scenario). The changing externalities leads to that gray area.

Re: Shame on Y Combinator

#262

Post by stochasticegg »

jaypaulynice wrote: post #178

I'm not a Trump supporter, but all the YC shaming is terrible. You're advocating for dictatorship where only one political view matters. Wikipedia: "A dictatorship is a type of authoritarianism, in which politicians regulate nearly every aspect of the public and private behavior of citizens."

This is exactly what's happening with today's political correctness.

I need to watch the daily news so politicians and news anchors can disseminate the naughty words of the week. Otherwise, I might unintentionally let the 'wrong' thing slip at work and get fired.

Being a blond haired, blue eyed Caucasian programmer, my manager is constantly looking for a reason to replace me since the company implemented it's diversity program. I'm one of the highest producing employees and I feel discriminated against, but it's politically incorrect to state this.

Re: Shame on Y Combinator

#263

Post by [deleted] »

ThomPete wrote: post #237
tptacek wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is in fact not a fundamental principle of democracy. There is no work of political philosophy anywhere that suggests we should be able to say whatever we'd like "without fear of repercussions". What is a principle of liberal philosophy, though, is that we should be tolerant of the beliefs of others (in the sense of not intervening to suppress them), including intolerant beliefs, until those intolerant beliefs th…

as long as no one have actually formulated an argument based on facts how Trump is a threat to democracy I dont see how he is more dangerous than Hillary, Bush or Obama. And i am pretty sure a large portion of people outide the US see those three as bigger threats to their lives than Trump given US foreign policy. So until someone show how the us system can be destroyed by Trump I stand by my position that Trump is n…

[deleted]

Re: Shame on Y Combinator

#264

Post by aljones »

jessaustin wrote: post #235
munin wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> he represents a group of people who haven't been represented for the last 40 years No he doesn't. He doesn't appeal to or represent poor whites, those vote D. He also doesn't appeal to or represent minorities, immigrants, or women. Those also vote D. He appeals to and represents white men that have a household income slightly higher than the median. Those people have been nothing but listened to for the last 140 ye…

You've been talking with a different set of poor whites than I have. I'm not a Trump supporter or potential voter, but we fool ourselves when we invoke this caricature.

Hopefully their information doesn't come from talking to people. There are better sources.

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-mythology-of-trumps-...

Re: Shame on Y Combinator

#265

Post by EJTH »

"Oh no, someone supports a political agenda different from mine. I'd better bring out the cannons and shame anything even remotely related to this person, because I don't agree with his political views!"

Re: Shame on Y Combinator

#266

Post by dreta »

tptacek wrote: post #204
ThomPete wrote: post #127

Marcos understanding of this situation is extremely telling for a fundamental problem with many americans relationship with politics. Most only get involved around election. After that their political interest is non existing. It's easy to get lured into the idea that politics is a simple choice between the moral good and the moral bad, that the choice is simple and that there is a one to one relationship between wha…

That is in fact not a fundamental principle of democracy. There is no work of political philosophy anywhere that suggests we should be able to say whatever we'd like "without fear of repercussions". What is a principle of liberal philosophy, though, is that we should be tolerant of the beliefs of others (in the sense of not intervening to suppress them), including intolerant beliefs, until those intolerant beliefs th…

All you’re doing is trying to shame Altman and Y Combinator supporters into disowing Thiel. The great thing about what Altman is doing is that he doesn’t feel so morally superior to others that he’ll either see people share his views, or have them removed. You should learn to criticise ideas, not people.

Re: Shame on Y Combinator

#267

Post by tptacek »

jobigoud wrote: post #184
samfisher83 wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nationally title 7 only protects you from the following: sex, race, color, national origin, and religion. There might be local state laws that protect you from politics, but no national law.

Religion is held higher than other forms of opinions like political stance? Weird.

A consequence of living in a country founded on freedom from religious persecution, something that Trump's supporters badly need to be reminded of.

Re: Shame on Y Combinator

#268

Post by Bartweiss »

Upvoter33 wrote: post #91
thght wrote: post #85

Shame on you for blaming Y Combinator. If it was 1.25 million for Clinton you would probably praise Y Combinator, no? This feels more like a clash between your personal political preferences and Mr Thiels's. You are just blaming Y Combinator to inflate this story, trying to get more people on the Clinton side. Shame on you!

Why do people keep making this false equivalence between the two options? One candidate has repeatedly taken racist and sexist stances, as well as demeaned those who are handicapped (and honestly, the list goes on and on). If people don't take a stand against this type of thing, it is a tacit acceptance.

This is serious question-begging, though.

Most of Trump's supporters don't accept that he's racist, or generally sexist, or the other charges being made. The ones I've talked to largely believe that he's just rude, and sometimes directs that through traits like race, gender, and disability. On policy, they would say that opposing things like illegal immigration isn't actually racism.

Laugh at that if you want, say they're stupid, but realize they're saying the exact same thing about you and the claim that Hillary is dangerously corrupt. "No she isn't, it's just..." - same structure.

My point is that you can't rescue a stance of "fire Trump supporters" by saying he's the bad guy. If that were consensus reality, the election would be over.

So you're absolutely opening the door to retribution from people who think the same way in reverse. That's exactly why the value of having a norm against punishing people for holding popular opinions, no matter how divisive.

Re: Shame on Y Combinator

#269

Post by rtpg »

dkopi wrote: post #187
smt88 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not lazy. It's showing the extreme (clearly unacceptable) end of the spectrum to ask someone how they decide where to draw the line. What would Trump have to do before supporting him is unacceptable to YC? But if you really don't want to use Hitler, try Rodrigo Duterte or Silvio Berlusconi instead. They actually share a lot of similarities to Trump.

"It's showing the extreme (clearly unacceptable) end of the spectrum to ask someone how they decide where to draw the line." That's actually very lazy. It's shifting the burden of "drawing the line" on the other side. It's the "well, why don't we just kill toddlers as well? Where do you draw the line?" in an abortion argument. It's the "why don't we just give 12 year old's automatic assault weapons" or "why don't we…

Very true. The line is important.

Trump has started heavily implying that the election will be rigged, Russia-style. He repeats Info Wars propaganda sillyness. He's come out to say that the elections will be stolen from true Americans by illegal immigrants. He's called for beating protestors.

Some of his positions are more a question of form rather than function compared to the political mainstream. His comments on muslims immigrating into the country are not far from the Republican Party mainstream, unfortunately.

But beyond his policies, he has been openly hostile to the concept of functioning democracy. There's a lazy comparison to be made to Hitler, but that's because Hitler also subverted the system through a cult of personality.

I know some people oppose him for his policies, but it feels internally inconsistent (you'd have to boycott most Republican supporters). But surely using strategies to undermine the legitimacy of the election results (that in a different country would be an obvious lead-up to a coup d'etat) is something we can all get behind as a bad thing.

Re: Shame on Y Combinator

#270

Post by ThomPete »

tptacek wrote: post #256
ThomPete wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or perhaps you are hijacking their words and misrepresent their actual opinions. Perhaps they dont believe its as litterally as you do. It would certainly make sense since claiming Trump is Stalin is as ill informed as it is absurd. Just like you are ready to ignore your principles for a bigger belief so is Theil. He is not voting for Trump he is voting for change. The very change everyone agrees is needed.

I am not.

Apparently they dont believe him to be a big enough threat to cut ties with Thiel for supporting him. Make of that what you want.
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