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SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

washingtonpost.com

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Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#261

Post by mc32 »

mbrutsch wrote: post #255
mc32 wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are more than one kind of homeless person. There are the ones who simply fell on hard times and don't have money to pay for rent. There are the ones suffer addiction, there are the ones who suffer mental trauma there are the ones who have severe mental disorders, there are the ones avoiding regular society, etc. Housing first works best for the fist class as well as those who have succumbed to addiction. Some o…

> there are the ones avoiding regular society, etc. Indeed, something as simple as smoking weed (regardless of the reason) will exclude you from most government assistance. Living indoors is not always a suitable trade-off for giving up medications that work.

Not even weed, there are government assisted housing units which will remove people for regular smoking.

But you also have people avoiding an address for whatever legal or avoidance reasons.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#262

Post by felixgallo »

marknutter wrote: post #240

This fucking sucks. I know Justin personally, and to see the vitriol being spewed forth at him makes my stomach churn. His blog post was clearly written out of frustration, and lacked nuance, but in no way does it justify the response it has received. None of these scathing articles or drive-by tweets are asking for clarification. Instead, his character is being assassinated as an extension of the growing fervor arou…

the 'mob' you're talking about is called 'civilization'. It's not 'growing fervor around [...] political correctness' that is driving the outrage; it's the deep-rooted, long-standing fervor about maintaining the minimum standard of being an empathetic, decent human being, which your friend has failed.

It's possible to write a letter to the mayor demanding solutions. It's possible to roll up your sleeves and try to do something, to marshal some force, to push the rock uphill a little for your fellow man.

It's also possible to write a whiny letter demanding that the homeless be made to vanish.

Which did your friend do? Which would you rather he did?

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#263

Post by zepto »

knowaveragejoe wrote: post #201
zepto wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's between 12k and 20k per person. Way less than you'd need to provide accommodation and treatment for a person with mental illness. It's not surprising it doesn't work.

The people blasting the city claim the city isn't doing enough, and when shown that they are actually are providing a remarkable amount of support, it still isn't enough. 12-20k annually is more than a significant chunk of the population earns in wages.

I don't really know what your point is. The amount may be a large dollar figure, but it is clearly not enough to solve the problem, therefore the problem still exists.

I'm curious how many people live in SF on 12-20k, but that's irrelevant. If someone has accommodation and is able to earn wages as a steady state, it is obvious that their costs will be less than a homeless person who needs mental health treatment, rehabilitation and maybe even education before they are employable.

The figure that employed people can survive on is well below the lower bound for what is needed to rehabilitate a homeless person.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#264

Post by myblake »

monkmartinez wrote: post #45
Afforess wrote: post #9

To play devil's advocate, he's right. He shouldn't have to see the pain, struggle, and despair of homeless - the city government should be providing affordable housing and shelters for the homeless. That it hasn't is a failure of the local government, and should be addressed. Much of the reason that affordable housing is out of reach of many in San Francisco is due to government regulation, not market capitalism. Ext…

This is a complex issue... but in my experience, most of the homeless are not looking for help to find jobs and/or contribute to society in manner that will lead them out of "homelessness." A lot of them prefer this "lifestyle"... we try very hard to help the people that want help. Most don't. Go talk to your local EMS/Fire department personnel and most of them will have similar stories. I know the homeless people in…

I suspect also many of the homeless in San Francisco, especially the ones being complained about here, have pretty bad mental health problems going on treated. Government probably needs to step in and help on that front as well.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#265

Post by allworknoplay »

koolba wrote: post #17

I don't want to see homeless people, drug deals, vomiting drunks, or pantless vagrants on my commute to work either. Does that make me heartless? I would hope not because otherwise these problems are not going to be solved. You need people who do NOT want to see that kind of crap on a daily basis to do something about it.

"That kind of crap" are generally people who have lived here significantly longer than he has and have been priced out due to factors not under their control. He doesn't care if _their_ problems are solved, only that _his_ problem is solved. It's a fairly disgusting attitude.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#266

Post by knowaveragejoe »

peanut_merchant wrote: post #218
knowaveragejoe wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The people blasting the city claim the city isn't doing enough, and when shown that they are actually are providing a remarkable amount of support, it still isn't enough. 12-20k annually is more than a significant chunk of the population earns in wages.

Throwing money at a problem is one thing. Intelligent allocation of that money is another. I'm not saying it isn't allocated effectively, just that the numbers themselves do not tell the whole tale.

Sure, I agree, but that's a bit different from whether they're supposedly ignoring the problem and/or not doing "enough".

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#268

Post by mikeash »

rconti wrote: post #241
mikeash wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your post made me realize that most of the complaints in this open letter aren't about homelessness, they're about crime. Quickly re-reading it, I see fights, indecent exposure, public disturbances, trespassing, harassment, assault. If this author had merely eliminated all mention of homelessness and replaced it with discussion of crime and criminals , it would have ditched all the heartless idiocy while still gettin…

I'm sympathetic with the parent post, of course, but the blog post repeated said he felt "unsafe" and then didn't bother to mention anything remotely dangerous that happened.

Someone leaning on your car and then getting into a street fight ought to qualify, I'd say. The other incidents don't seem safety related, just weird and possibly uncomfortable.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#269

Post by marknutter »

shopkins wrote: post #146
dederp wrote: post #78

I read his article. He is right, San Francisco has severe, unbelievable problems with homelessness and drugs which are so painfully obvious to anyone who has ever visited I felt like I was reading something out of the twilight zone. I hate the climate of hostility towards anyone who remotely points this problem out. The reaction and tone of this article is exactly why I hate looking at Twitter now. It has become a pl…

The hostility is warranted when you think you're solving a problem by whining about it on Medium. We all have homeless problems in our cities. We get accosted by mentally ill people, drunk people, high people, strung out people, dirty people. We smell piss on the street corners. But we don't publish it on the internet because of some grandiose vision that our words will suddenly shine light on the issue and spur some…

There is simply no justification for the level of backlash he is receiving. None.

>But we don't publish it on the internet because of some grandiose vision that our words will suddenly shine light on the issue and spur someone to action.

Sure, we all just step over the homeless, ignore the problem, and go about our day. Justin expressed his frustration, and guess what we're all talking about now - that uncomfortable thing we all choose to ignore.

>But when you can't even make your argument without using pejorative language, you've failed.

Then the author of the Washington Post article failed as well. Wielding the might of a nationally syndicated newspaper to rant about "tech bros" and publicly eviscerate a single individual is disgusting.

>And this reaction is what you get, so the rest of us can see this isn't how you fix the problem.

So unless we can provide the solution to a problem we're not allowed to complain about it or expression frustration about it? That sounds like a great way to suppress any conversation about the problem. And judging by the current situation in SF this is exactly what has happened.

Well guess what - by writing that article this "tech bro" has brought more attention to the problem of homelessness than has been paid in years, and although it all could have been written with more nuance, it's a hell of a lot more than most people are doing; which is exactly nothing.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#270

Post by staz »

StavrosK wrote: post #109
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...and why we have few/no homeless in my town: it stays around 16F for weeks at a time. And goes negative overnight. Also, the Emergency Housing Project, an Ecumenical service my UU Church started 20 years ago.

A solution to the OP's problem presents itself: Make SF colder!

another reason to fight global warming !
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