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Desktop Neo – rethinking the desktop interface for productivity

desktopneo.com

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Re: Desktop Neo – rethinking the desktop interface for productivity

#261
I've seen a hell of a lot of annoying UI/UX design over my 40+ years of computer use. And very little that's not entirely derivative of Doug Englebart's Mother of All Demos, in December of 1968.

Lennart's selecting from among the best widespread ideas, adding in several that are currently fringe, and coming up with a few twists of his own. The result is several things I'd very much like to have right now.

Any company looking hard at the desktop would be idiotic not to make him an offer. Lennart would be best advised to pick very carefully from among those he's tendered, and to make clear his own expectations.

The losers will be chasing his taillights for the next 20 years. Possibly 40.

The vision here is strong, but practical. It's dispensing of numerous tired elements of existing design, but replacing them with what appear to be far more workable models. I see some weaknesses and holes in the presentation, but at this stage these are details, not as is so often the case baked-in architectural flaws.

The synthesis of tiling, desktop, and touch interfaces in particularly is quite promising.

My biggest concern is that Lennart would accept an offer where his ideas would be absorbed into the black hole of an ossified company.

The obvious contenders for him are Apple, Google, and Microsoft. Ubuntu and Mozilla might be in the offing, and dark horses might emerge from Amazon or one of the existing hardware vendors -- Asus, Samsung, or LG, perhaps.

I think Apple, Microsoft, and Amazon would all be mistakes. The first two are far too wedded to their legacy platforms. Amazon is simply a horrible place to work, and the first rule is to not work for assholes.

Google, Ubuntu, or Mozilla offer the opportunity to develop this project and maintain an open-source offering. They'd probably be at the top of my list. I've suggested Google talk to Lennart and make him an offer.

One of the major hardware vendors might be of interest. I haven't kept track of where KDE/Qt are headed, but that's another option.

What I'm most thinking is, "damn, this would be a great time for a credible challenger for the desktop to appear". I'm not sure there is one.

But the world is Lennart's oyster.

I've commented further on the interface, and on what I see as weaknesses based on the presentation:

https://plus.google.com/104092656004159577193/posts/bzZws5Vh...

Re: Desktop Neo – rethinking the desktop interface for productivity

#262

It seems like a lot of people skimmed without reading the top or bottom of this site: It's not a company. It's not a product. You're not being asked to buy it or buy into it, just to discuss the concept if you'd like. This website is a portfolio piece for a 21-year-old university student hoping to find an internship. In my opinion, it's an impressive demonstration of his design and technical skills. It certainly says…

Microsoft should hire him yesterday.

Re: Desktop Neo – rethinking the desktop interface for productivity

#264

The gestures for fullscreen and minimize operations need 6 fingers. Using both hands to do anything on a touch screen seems very impractical (except for typing with both the thumbs on a reasonably sized screen or a split keyboard).

Yeah, the two 6 finger gestures are certainly not ideal. I imagined a much larger touchpad, between the size of the Apple Keyboard and Apple Trackpad, so that might make it a little easier. It's also important to note that these two gestures perform features (fullscreen / minimize) that can also be done by just resizing the panel (either with 3 fingers, or by going to App Control).

Why not put touch sensitivity into the keys so we can make gestures while our fingers are on the keyboard?

Re: Desktop Neo – rethinking the desktop interface for productivity

#265
post #6

Hmm, isn't that "just" a tiling window manager at the bottom of a few other nice things? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiling_window_manager While feeling the shortcomings of a window system, I never felt like I could productively work with a tiling manager, since I frequently overlap windows as a mechanism for easy access ... and there are lots of popup windows I don't want to cover the main application. Oh yes, and…

Yes, panels follow similar ideas and have similar advantages to tiling windows. However, I don’t think that the benefit of being able to work with windows that aren't full-height outweighs their added complexity compared to using only full-height panels. With todays technology and established interface patterns from mobile, I believe it's feasible to use the ideas of tiling window managers beyond a niche market.

First: full-height maximisation is sufficiently useful to me that I gravitate strongly toward environments which allow me to hotkey this. WindowMaker's remained my go-to largely for this reason, along with a handful of others.

Second: less-than-full-height windows can be quite useful. Being able to specify a "stack" into which, say, I place a video (or video-chat) app, various A/V controls, and possibly some monitors or other smaller windows, perhaps a shorter terminal window or three, is easily something I'd like to do.

With WindowMaker I can _arrange_ windows in a pseudo-tiled state. Unfortunately it's too easy to accidentally drag one off somewhere. Generally, though, this can be quite handy.

What I'd really like to be able to do is to specify roles for certain window locations. Say, a browser, image editor, and audio editor all occupying the same larger window space, which I can tab between.

And I think you're quite right about applicability of tiling metaphors.

Re: Desktop Neo – rethinking the desktop interface for productivity

#266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a very good point. Much of this UI is based on visual clues and accessibility seems to be an afterthought. A three finger tap or swipe is not easy for everyone. I'd like to see more (digital) navigation based on actual (physical) navigation -- waypoint labels and directional paths.

Any swipe is virtually impossible in an office situation. Not everyone works hunched over a macbook. Reaching up to my monitor two swipe would destroy my shoulder.

Touch screens obviously aren't the answer here, but a good trackpad setup might be okay. I used to use Apple's "magic trackpad" when I had a macintosh desktop, and it did gesture inputs really well, though I always seemed to run into discomfort/strain issues earlier than I did with a mouse (which is part of why I switched back.) That could be unique to me, but I'd guess that the need to hover your hand above the pad is not good for anyone. I'd be up for trying that setup again if someone had a good idea to solve that problem.

Re: Desktop Neo – rethinking the desktop interface for productivity

#267

The biggest thing I find lacking in desktop UI is the ability to save and switch between states. We need the idea of project 'sessions' where I can open up the software I need to use, pull up the files I need, set my favorite folders, etc and then hit 'save' and be able to restore back to that setup at the click of a button. Right now, switching between projects means setting all that up every single time.

State preservation, generally, is a huge failing of computing. From losing my desktop arrangements in Linux between reboots (or even logins), to Web tools that lose comments and posts, etc.

Being able to specify a workspace state and return to it is hugely significant. But that requires deep stateful awareness of pretty much every app, including terminals, and the command / console-mode tools running within them.

But at the higher level, I'm liking what I'm seeing here.

Re: Desktop Neo – rethinking the desktop interface for productivity

#269
post #187

I would love to have that radial context on right hold + move. In browser at least. Gone would be mouse gestures, but I think that this can capture quite a few of them and make them more accessible. Anyone? :)

That's a feature of the PocketBook ebook reader Android app.

Re: Desktop Neo – rethinking the desktop interface for productivity

#270

The very first thing I noticed in the first image with 2 side by side is the example with wikipedia on the right. Wikipedia has side bars I don't care or need to see. This is exactly the instance I'd have the left one overlapping the roght to cover it up. Giving me more space to left. And chrome still allows me to scroll the window behind. Without clicking or bringing focus to it. Many applications also havesidebara…

Wikipedia's mobile site (and Android app) dispense with the sidebars.

More generally: I'm finding myself prefering to negate sites' own styling increasingly, with very few exceptions. I'll reach for the "Reader Mode" button on my browser as the page loads (which, of course, doesn't work), and wish that that were the default instead.

Which is another area in which Desktop Neo might care to innovate. Treating documents uniformly regardless of where they originate.

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