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Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over Emissions Software

nytimes.com

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Re: Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over Emissions Software

#261

Post by newjersey »

samstave wrote: post #236
bardworx wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm always surprised when people don't realize that large bikes are suppose to be loud so that drivers can hear them coming. It's a necessary evil.

I hate loud motorcycles. I live in a quiet neighborhood in Alameda -- and I have small kids that sleep and take naps. I dont like loud bikes driving by and waking them up :-/

I agree. Please be active in the opposition to regulation requiring electric and hybrid vehicles to make a noise as well. We don't need more noise!

Re: Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over Emissions Software

#262

Post by sokoloff »

ibarrajo wrote: post #234
johnny99 wrote: post #115

Given the low cost and ubiquity of sensors nowadays, you'd think it would be feasible to require car makers to test emissions in real time, in the real world.

We already have that, It's called OBDII. Besides error codes, OBDII has 8 emissions monitors. In California all cars after 2001 are checked by means of a visual and these 8 readiness monitors: catalyst, heated catalyst, EVAP, SAI, O2, O2 Heater, EGR/VVT, AC Source: I work on my two Audis

If you need to, you can beat most O2 monitors with a 555, most O2 heater monitors with a $0.45 resistor (or an O2 heater from a neutered O2 sensor), an EGR sensor monitor with a diode and couple resistors. Many catalyst monitors are just downstream O2 sensors that detect cycling (another 555 will defeat).

OBD2 monitoring, without fairly careful visual inspection, isn't a full solution. It's used because it's cheap, easy, and close to good enough, but enthusiasts are easily able to defeat it, for "off road use only", of course...

Re: Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over Emissions Software

#264

Post by sokoloff »

JorgeGT wrote: post #23
gnoway wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't the emissions systems affect performance? I have a 2012 Golf TDI and really like it, one of the advantages over one of the hybrids is that I get pretty great fuel economy for the kind of driving I do, but it doesn't feel like I'm driving a weed eater. This really pisses me off. It doesn't surprise me I guess but it never occurred to me that a car manufacturer could get away with something like this for, apparen…

Yes, a common strategy is to inject more EGR (exhaust gas) into the fresh intake air. As EGR is already burned, it is inert, so it negatively affects the combustion, lowering the temperature. With lower combustion temperature you get less NOx... but less power for each amount of fuel, so your efficiency/performance is lower, and also non burned products (CO, C) increase. You then trap those with the Diesel Particulat…

EGR on a diesel also terribly gunks up the intake manifold downstream of the EGR introduction point. For that reason (and the loss of power and efficiency), it's often defeated.

Re: Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over Emissions Software

#265

Post by lutorm »

selimthegrim wrote: post #213
GFK_of_xmaspast wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's my understanding that there's plenty of aftermarket opportunities available for this kind of tuning.

VW denies you warranty repairs if you do this tuning if the damage can be traced to ECU modifications. Class action lawsuit in 3...2...1...

That's a perfectly reasonable policy.

Re: Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over Emissions Software

#266

Post by lutorm »

swang wrote: post #208
nradov wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Individual anecdotes don't mean much. You can find objective data on car reliability on TrueDelta and Long-Term Quality Index. Those aren't true random samples but still pretty useful. http://www.truedelta.com/car-reliability http://tradeinqualityindex.com/reports/Volkswagen.html

_My_ story is anecdotal but early 2000 VWs are known for being really shitty. this have this history. I heard they have gotten "better" but a bit too late for me to care about.

I had a 2001 Passat 1.8T (that I got used in 2003) had a slew of problem covered under the VW CPO warranty. Fortuitously enough, after that warranty expired, it ran like a clock for 8 years. (But I wasn't afraid to service it myself either.

Re: Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over Emissions Software

#267

Post by toomuchtodo »

nickbauman wrote: post #237
mikeash wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your vehicle can't be safe without annoying everyone within a quarter mile radius, it's too unsafe to be on the road.

Like your spirit (I don't like the loud pipes either) but this is a little unfair. Motorcycling should be part of a more sustainable future. Especially when you consider how many OECD commuters commute in cars alone.

Motorcycling is 45 times more likely to result in death than driving in a car.

Electric vehicles are sustainable, motorcycles are death traps that can't be made safer (said as an ex-owner of a Katana, and both a Yamaha R1 sport bike and Roadliner cruiser).

Re: Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over Emissions Software

#268

Post by PhasmaFelis »

bardworx wrote: post #222
Raphmedia wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, as much as a cheat it is, I'm happy that those bikes can go quiet on slow (city) streets but as loud as possible on the highway (increase security and swag).

I'm always surprised when people don't realize that large bikes are suppose to be loud so that drivers can hear them coming. It's a necessary evil.

This is the silliest thing I've read all day. For starters, you're implying that drivers have less need to perceive small bikes...or other cars, apparently.

Re: Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over Emissions Software

#269

Post by toomuchtodo »

brobinson wrote: post #242
vesrah wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Almost all supersport bikes coming into the US utilize both of these strategies. :) I own a Ducati 999 that was lemonlawed because it would stall at stop lights. Super common and happened because of how lean the bikes had to run to pass US emissions.

Google said "random stalls" were kind of endemic to Ducatis. :P Didn't know it was related to the fuel mapping! I had a 1098 which would occasionally (maybe once per month) randomly stall at 0% throttle when braking to a stop. I had a full Termignoni system + race ECU, though. California doesn't do emissions testing on bikes, surprisingly! I had to put a Power Commander on my R1 because of the aforementioned lean spo…

I can assure you that the engine on the R1 doesn't chug along at sport bike speeds though ;)

Re: Volkswagen Is Ordered to Recall Nearly 500k Vehicles Over Emissions Software

#270

Post by Asbostos »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #194
McGlockenshire wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That maths out to somewhere in the ballpark of eighteen billion dollars. In 2012, the EPA issued $252 million in fines, total. Kia & Hyundai were fined $300 million total in 2014. I don't see them hitting VW with eighteen billion. e: Eh, that might not be so unreasonable after all. In 2012, VW made about $28 billion in profit on $250 billion of sales.

If the cars can't pass smog testing without cheating, then they also need to be forced to buy each and every one of them back. $18 billion sounds reasonable to me. This needs to hurt .

I'm sure the patch will allow them to pass the tests. It'll just reduce driving performance as well.
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