Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance • Hacker News Board

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#251

Post by SloopJon » Tue, Oct 28, 2014, 4:37 PM UTC

merih wrote: post #176

letstryagain wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have 200 tabs open? How do you find the tab you want? How often do you look at each of the 200 tabs? What happens when you're on another computer? What happens if you accidentally close Chrome, do you open all 200 tabs again?

In Firefox you can search among open tabs by typing % in the awesomebar, I use this everyday with hundreds of tabs open. And there is also tab groups feature (which is activated by ctrl/cmd+shift+e). I don't know why this feature is not advertised more.

The "%" search sounds really interesting, but I can't seem to get it to work. No matter what I type after the "%", it initiates a web search. This is with Firefox 33 for Mac.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#252

Post by MichaelGG » Tue, Oct 28, 2014, 4:38 PM UTC

valarauca1 wrote: post #183

SquareWheel wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's also completely free for Google to advertise on their own website.

Yes but that doesn't mean the economic value is non-existent. Theoretically Google could sell that space. They trade this potential profit to promote their own product, at a loss, of how ever much that space could be sold for. This is like economics 202, opportunity cost.

It's not that simple. It's easy enough to claim that showing a Chrome ad benefits users and helps Google's brand. Showing third party ads hurts Google's brand and overall value.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#253

Post by valarauca1 » Tue, Oct 28, 2014, 4:43 PM UTC

MichaelGG wrote: post #252

valarauca1 wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes but that doesn't mean the economic value is non-existent. Theoretically Google could sell that space. They trade this potential profit to promote their own product, at a loss, of how ever much that space could be sold for. This is like economics 202, opportunity cost.

It's not that simple. It's easy enough to claim that showing a Chrome ad benefits users and helps Google's brand. Showing third party ads hurts Google's brand and overall value.

Only if the 3rd party project is subpar. largely chrome is a 3rd party project from the eyes of search. I'm pretty sure there isn't a massive overlap between search and chrome developers at google.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#254

Post by espadrine » Tue, Oct 28, 2014, 4:44 PM UTC

0942v8653 wrote: post #250

espadrine wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Based on my current knowledge, I believe you are wrong. Firefox' Desktop Awesomebar (which actually predates Chrome's omnibox) does not send every keystroke to Google[0], and never has. Even Firefox' Mobile Awesomebar doesn't do that[1] unless you click that "Yes" button. On the other hand, Google's Chrome browser is clear about the fact that it does send everything in the omnibar[2]: > When you type URLs or queries…

Huh. Your first link says nothing about search suggestions. I based my comment on my experience of having to disable search suggestions every time I start a new browser. I hope you're right…

Here's a Quora answer from Asa Dotzler, to make you feel better: http://www.quora.com/Why-hasnt-Firefox-merged-their-search-b...

Obviously, I can't prove that it doesn't send search suggestions by giving you a link to the code, since it isn't there. If you want to make sure for yourself, I advise using Wireshark.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#255

Post by magicalist » Tue, Oct 28, 2014, 4:44 PM UTC

joemccall86 wrote: post #222

I keep going back and forth between Firefox and Chrome. Chrome is ahead right now for two reasons: 1. Support for Netflix on linux 2. Webapps as native applications (like the old project prism). We use slack at work and a Chrome webapp is how they choose to support Linux. Admittedly though, I will switch to Firefox for the rest of the week to see if I can live with these caveats.

There's also nothing that says you can't have two different browsers open at once :)

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#256

Post by 0942v8653 » Tue, Oct 28, 2014, 4:45 PM UTC

thathonkey wrote: post #233

ripdog wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DuckDuckGo has a 'bang' feature, where you add a bang like '!g' to search a different site directly. For example, '!g hacker news' becomes ' https://encrypted.google.com/search?hl=en&q=hacker%20news' .

Sorry, I understand that part. Was wondering what you meant by this (specifically the part about a "filtered down view of the world"): "I find this better even just for the fact that I don't get the filtered down view of the world anymore - if there are things named similarly than the ones I use in the world, I want to know, so I can adjust my own naming." It wasn't a loaded question or anything, not sure why I got d…

Google gives you a "filter bubble", essentially exacerbating confirmation bias. That way if you search "what's wrong with Python" it won't return "snakes can hurt you".

Take a look at http://dontbubble.us

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#257

Post by cpeterso » Tue, Oct 28, 2014, 4:52 PM UTC

carussell wrote: post #197

jfoutz wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't it actually whoever will pay the most to be the default search? I mean, I <3 google search, but i'd bet microsoft could pony up quite a bit of cash as well.

Once upon a time, you could come across a post like this and confidently respond to it by pointing out that, no, Google's position as the default search engine in Firefox is not for sale to the highest bidder. So that even if, e.g.: a) the "deal" with Google had never happened, and b) Microsoft came out of nowhere and began offering to pay what Google is actually presently paying (or, let's say, just for fun, even do…

Years ago, Google was head and shoulders above all other search engines. Today Google's competition are almost as good, so other parameters might affect Mozilla's search engine defaults.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#258

Post by GFK_of_xmaspast » Tue, Oct 28, 2014, 4:55 PM UTC

DannyBee wrote: post #229

coldtea wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Comic-book style? Who said anything about that? Just greedy capitalist style, and "patriotic" pro-US-interests style.

Given that everyone at the top has more money than they know what to do with, what would "greed" have to do with it?

Mega-laffo if you think that the super-rich don't want to become ultra-rich.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#259

Post by magicalist » Tue, Oct 28, 2014, 4:56 PM UTC

roca wrote: post #72

ivanca wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, no. They chose intensive process, many of them are ports of code from other languages and some the tests are using software made by Mozilla such as pdf.jz and zlib (Ecmascripten) and Microsoft (Typescript compiler) https://developers.google.com/octane/benchmark

But they also included stuff like splay-latency which explicitly tests something that doesn't matter on the Web (support for incremental GC during script execution, which doesn't matter in browsers because the effects of a script are never made visible to the user until the script ends). Guess what, V8 has that and Spidermonkey doesn't.

Can you explain more what you think is unfair about the test? I've only given it[1] a brief read and it certainly is a synthetic benchmark, but it doesn't seem absurdly artificial.

I've certainly written JS that builds trees, modifies them, tears them down, and builds new ones, all within the same event loop turn, and so would certainly benefit from incremental GC in the cases when the data it's working over is very large (or it's just a part of an app that's already been burning through a large number of allocations).

[1] https://code.google.com/p/octane-benchmark/source/browse/tru...

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#260

Post by cpeterso » Tue, Oct 28, 2014, 4:58 PM UTC

MichaelGG wrote: post #161

m_mueller wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find duckduckgo quite usable for commonplace CS things such as programming in popular languages. For more obscure things I usually just enter g! [query] into my URL bar, so it will revert to an anonymous google. I find this better even just for the fact that I don't get the filtered down view of the world anymore - if there are things named similarly than the ones I use in the world, I want to know, so I can adjust…

Really? I tried to use DDG, I really did. But the results are just so subpar unless it was a simple "navigational" type search where I knew exactly what I was looking for. I really want to quit Google. I'd even pay for it. But they just dominate by such a large margin.

DDG results have greatly improved over the last year. I tried switching from Google to DDG a couple years ago, but didn't last more than a week. DDG results are as good (and nicer looking) than Google for general searches, but I still rely on Google for needle in a haystack searches.