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Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

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Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#251

Post by dabinat »

hakunin wrote: post #195
autoexec wrote: post #8

Corruption in the US isn't new, but it's never been done as openly as it has been recently. I don't think it's a good thing. It shows that the government isn't concerned about what the public thinks, which suggests that they believe they no longer have to be. That's not a healthy sign for what's supposed to be a democracy.

Saying “US corruption isn’t new” is a truism. There are probably isolated incidents, and many unproven theories, but everyone is quick to agree with this statement because it’s a common feeling everyone has now for some reason. The reality of corruption is likely much smaller and more boring than people think. What we’re witnessing now is what should be called corruption. That corruption that everyone has been scream…

I guess it’s more accurate to say that corruption didn’t start with Trump (he wasn’t even involved in politics when Citizens United was happening, for example). The US has been marching in that direction for a while.

The difference now is the openness and also the scale. If a president does one bad thing the press will dig into it, committees will investigate, etc. But what if the president does 20 bad things every single day? The press doesn’t know how to report on that and the legal process is as slow as molasses. And by tomorrow everyone will have forgotten because there’ll be new bad things.

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#252

Post by aprilthird2021 »

iamnothere wrote: post #108
jeffbee wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Implying that it's always been this way is part of the reason we are now here. For my entire life, bad faith commentators insinuated that the federal government was rife with corruption. When under Democratic control, of course. The time that Al Gore made one long-distance telephone call from his official desk, using his own personal calling card, birthed over 200 New York Times articles, 30 of them on the front page…

The problems that happened during the Clinton admin (with the exception of Whitewater) weren’t so much corruption as they were short-sighted neoliberal trade deals and hostility to organized labor, which accelerated the process of hollowing out the country. But this was also an unusual period in US history due to the end of the Cold War, so this administration could be an exception. Most of the scandals from this per…

> short-sighted neoliberal trade deals and hostility to organized labor, which accelerated the process of hollowing out the country

What if they weren't short-sighted and not hostile? Look at Germany, which did not do this and instead kept strong provisions in favor of organized labor and protecting their domestic industry from foreign entrants.

They can't keep doing it anymore. That would have been our future. But we pivoted to high skilled services and it has served us immensely better than if we had tried to defeat other powers in industrial and manufacturing where they had a clear advantage we didn't, in terms of cost.

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#253

Post by aprilthird2021 »

pseudosavant wrote: post #38

Looking at their charts, Democrats and Independents clearly think corruption is up a lot since 2024. But Republicans think corruption is down from 2024. The polarization of the electorate in the U.S. is pretty incredible.

That's crazy lol, how do you watch the President pump and dump Trumpcoin and then come back for pt. 2 with Melaniacoin and think corruption is down?

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#254

Post by grebc »

aprilthird2021 wrote: post #247
guerrilla wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reading things like this help me understand how so many people fall for scams. You're so extremely trusting that it's hard to wrap my mind around... I can't relate on any level.

Prove him wrong. Show us documented cases of corruption from, say Obama, or Biden, or Bush Jr. And then we'll compare it to the documented cases of Trump corruption, starting with his 2 crypto pump-and-dump schemes and his family's fake crypto company (3 already very brazenly open ones and there are more!) and let's see if you can pull similar for any of the previous presidents of the 21st century

Dick Cheney.

Edit: I don’t really care though, I’m not a US citizen. Trump is terrible still. Shouldn’t have voted him in. :shrug:

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#255

Post by aprilthird2021 »

baxtr wrote: post #244
dozerly wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US’s democracy has been under fire from foreign nations and corporations for years. It has slowly degraded because of it. What we’re seeing now is the “all at once” portion.

It started on 9/11. I find it sad that those terrorist might can get what aimed for after all.

They got it when the PATRIOT ACT was passed. That was the proof that all our rights and liberties are conditional, and Trump uses the revelation of that back then to pull off everything he is doing now

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#257

Post by kstenerud »

What I find fascinating about this is how the American commenters are eating their own, Democrats blaming Republicans, Republicans blaming Democrats, both spinning conspiracy yarns about "the other side" as well as independents ("the other side in disguise"), and generally treating each other like "the enemy".

Some other interesting tidbits:

- In America, perception of government corruption has consistently held about 11% higher than the perception of corruption in business. Even with the massive uptick of both since 2024, they've remained a similar relative distance apart.

- Since 2023, only four countries out of the 132 in which Gallup has posed this question annually have scored nominally above the 89% recorded in the U.S. this year: Lebanon in 2024 (92%), Peru in 2025 (92%), and Ghana and Nigeria in 2024 (both 90%).

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#258

Post by rfrey »

scrubs wrote: post #93
2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more like a third. > 35% approve, 61% disapprove, 5% not sure https://www.economist.com/interactive/trump-approval-tracker

That 35% will change their tune if it screws their stuff up. Trump et al is great in the large unless he's your business partner or boss screwing your money and life up, hitting on your wife or daughter, owes you money etc. Cheap symbolism is appealing in a fog only, not in your face.

Plenty of people have become alienated from their own family due to blind loyalty to Trump and support for his cruelty. They remain loyal.

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#259

Post by Animats »

This has to stop. Ask candidates how tough they're willing to get on corruption.

A good starting point for the next administration is to offer an amnesty on criminal prosecution to government employees who report anything of value they received outside their employment during the previous administration. If it's reported, they're safe from criminal prosecution. Anything that's not reported that surfaces later, bribery charges.

Then they have to pay it back to the government. Tangible objects (watches, jewelry) have to be turned in to a forfeiture office. Travel and entertainment are charged at a fixed rate (probably the max value the Government will pay for meals and travel to senior executives, so a trip on a private jet only means a first class fare). Allow easy repayments, with interest at the IRS late payment rate.

That's about the right level of pressure.

Re: Record-High 89% in U.S. Say Government Corruption Widespread

#260

Post by dabinat »

dfxm12 wrote: post #66
autoexec wrote: post #8

Corruption in the US isn't new, but it's never been done as openly as it has been recently. I don't think it's a good thing. It shows that the government isn't concerned about what the public thinks, which suggests that they believe they no longer have to be. That's not a healthy sign for what's supposed to be a democracy.

This is putting mildly. The most damning bit might just be that Republican voters saw all the corruption of Trump I and decided they wanted more.

More than that, in 2020 Trump got a record number of votes for any Republican or sitting president ever. In other circumstances he would have won. It’s just that Biden also got a record number of votes.
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