A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline • Hacker News Board

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#251

Post by drstewart » Thu, May 14, 2026, 4:05 PM UTC

999900000999 wrote: post #223

It's ok. The top colleges are arguably now in China. China is providing free education in many poor African countries. Chinese is one of many subjects offered. Of course, a smart African college student will have no issue learning English, Chinese, as well her home countries language. The future belongs to China. We're elevating fine institutions such as Liberty University and celebrating comedians and edge lords. Ch…

>The top colleges are arguably now in China.

Argued by who? Source?

>We're elevating fine institutions...

Who? Maybe you mean Europe? After all, why aren't all those brilliant African students studying German or Italian? I assume you also mean that Europe has terrible universities and has completely ceded the future to glorious China?

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#252

Post by spwa4 » Thu, May 14, 2026, 4:05 PM UTC

rfergie wrote: post #169

jrflo wrote: post #147

Besides the people in this thread bemoaning the state of research funding, international students, etc. (all of which are valid), a lot of people are becoming disillusioned with academia. Probably 80% of the recent PhD grads I know are looking to leave academia, despite the fact that they went into it to pursue a career in academia. The median science PhD takes 6 years now, and is grueling work for terrible pay, all…

> Probably 80% of the recent PhD grads I know are looking to leave academia, despite the fact that they went into it to pursue a career in academia Has this changed recently?

Yes, in positivist sciences 20% intending to stay would be very high by historical standards.

This paper https://dspace.mit.edu/handle/1721.1/93208 gives and estimate 87% PhD holders leave before becoming (tenured) faculty. And that's academia-wide. In the sciences more will be leaving. In exact sciences yet again more.

Truth is most people leave before even getting a PhD, so it's even worse (and the advice is to think long and hard before doing a PhD, and certainly starting one because you can't find a job for a few months is sure to result in disappointment)

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

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Post by gosub100 » Thu, May 14, 2026, 4:05 PM UTC

jalapenoj wrote: post #194

slg wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Historians looking back at this era are going to struggle to understand why we made the decisions we did.

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Or finding out that he was just the tip of a giant iceberg that corrupted every square inch of our government.

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

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Post by JimBlackwood » Thu, May 14, 2026, 4:06 PM UTC

andrepd wrote: post #217

cmiles8 wrote: post #155

Academia is about to go through a generational reset. The system is broken and the market only tolerates broken systems for so long. There are a ton of great things that come out of universities but it’s also clear that a model of charging folks well into the six-figures for a useless degree that doesn’t prepare them for the workforce is dead and a reckoning is underway. Many schools will fail and shut down. Of those…

This is about research, science research in particular. "Preparing for the workforce" is not the point here (and arguably should not really be the point of education in general, but much can be said about that...). You speak of "market" and "cost-value" and economic darwinism. You seem to be confused: many things do not work based on next-quarter revenue optimisation, fundamental science research being one of them.

> This is about research, science research in particular. "Preparing for the workforce" is not the point here (and arguably should not really be the point of education in general, but much can be said about that...).

This is a bit short sighted. Not all university studies are for fundamental science (law, for instance). Some university studies need to work together with industry (again, law. or some physics studies).

Next to that, even for studies that do fundamental research (mathematics), a lot of people attend university for it’s job prospects. For instance, if you want to become an actuary - having done mathematics as a degree will help.

My point being, a large part of university studies and their students are there to “Prepare for the workforce”. I don’t think you can do without that. Fundamental research is not some fantasy world that can do without industry or other things developed by the outside world.

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#255

Post by gosub100 » Thu, May 14, 2026, 4:06 PM UTC

slg wrote: post #96

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup, it’s called a brain drain and it’s why until recently America held a vice grip on groundbreaking research and its commercialization.

Historians looking back at this era are going to struggle to understand why we made the decisions we did.

There will be no more historians. Their jobs will be lost to AI.

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#256

Post by CamperBob2 » Thu, May 14, 2026, 4:07 PM UTC

busterarm wrote: post #162

coryrc wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Our systems need to be MORE democratic! First Pass The Post is democratic, but the worst way of it. In most districts, 40-49% of voters are disenfranchised by gerrymandering. Mixed Member Proportional is far more representative. If you assume certain minority groups vote as a bloc, then you can't gerrymander them away like our current system does. The proportion of people not getting representation is capped by 1/num…

We're (at least) 10 years into this mess now and still everyone is focused on restructuring our systems and prosecutions instead of putting forward a platform that broadly appeals to enough Americans to decisively win elections. What I said applies to both parties. We're not really all that different but all the incentives align towards pleasing extremists. Do you really need any more evidence of this than people get…

Do you really need any more evidence of this than people getting shot and people/press generally being okay with it?

Democrats who push gun control at the cost of everything else -- such as the possibility of turning Texas blue -- are a big reason why the party lacks power to influence anything else.

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#257

Post by MSFT_Edging » Thu, May 14, 2026, 4:07 PM UTC

cmiles8 wrote: post #155

Academia is about to go through a generational reset. The system is broken and the market only tolerates broken systems for so long. There are a ton of great things that come out of universities but it’s also clear that a model of charging folks well into the six-figures for a useless degree that doesn’t prepare them for the workforce is dead and a reckoning is underway. Many schools will fail and shut down. Of those…

> bringing the cost-value equation back to a defensible reality.

I firmly believe looking at academia through this lens is part of the reason why it has been so firmly exploited as a business.

To treat the school as a business in partnership with corporation treats the student as the customer and product. Like everything in our time, the push for profit leads to optimization and enshitification.

The student experience, student outcome, and quality of academia have all been sent through the enshitification wringer.

We can point to the lowering in quality of research to this, the reliance on poorly paid grad students, which end up producing worse work, worse research, and less effect on industry.

I firmly believe there needs to be a degree of separation between academia and corporate interests.

To optimize for profit finds local maxima and limits the ability of academia to do real research.

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

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Post by drstewart » Thu, May 14, 2026, 4:07 PM UTC

j_maffe wrote: post #55

mainecoder wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No this is not good for the World in case you have forgotten America is part of the world and though I hate what is happening just as much as anyone I will work to make this nation better. We are in a tough time and I genuinely do not know if things will get better but we will try.

> America is part of the world A belligerent part of the world. I hope the US gets better in that regard.

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Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

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Post by Zigurd » Thu, May 14, 2026, 4:08 PM UTC

Arodex wrote: post #242

brianjlogan wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of historical precedent for an intellectual elite ignoring the perception and needs of the common folk leading to an uprising. I'd imagine every great(in scale/importance) uprising/political tumult had some aspect of "but they're ruining everything!" Everything for intellectuals and people with ties to the system that was functioning for that minority. Coal miners don't care that international students aren't co…

The Confederates' common folks tried to burn the USA to the ground to save their inalienable right to own slaves. Who will listen to the "perception and needs" of the racist, misogynistic common folks who want to impose their religious liberty (by banning abortion) and and elevate their financial situation (by pushing downward brown and black people)? (The GOP, that's who.) And don't you tell me it's a minority, when…

We need to finish Reconstruction. That sounds idealistic, even pie in the sky unrealistic. But we could certainly measure progress in that direction: US incarceration rates are insanely high, and the prison industrial complex is modern slavery. We would know victory when we put fewer people in prison than China, for example.

That's not the only symptom, or the only measure of progress. But it would be a good start.

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#260

Post by nukedindia » Thu, May 14, 2026, 4:08 PM UTC

cmiles8 wrote: post #208

potbelly83 wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Education yes, research unfortunately no. I'm not saying research outside of academia is not possible, I'm just saying it's not taken seriously and this needs to change. We really do need to go back to the 19th century model of the researcher gentleman.

A real shock to academia is that top research increasingly takes place outside universities. On many areas universities are now 5-10 years behind what’s happening in the private sector. That’s causing a lot of panic within the system and a growing stream of departures as PhDs favor the private sector over academic tracts.

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