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How NASA built Artemis II’s fault-tolerant computer

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Re: How NASA built Artemis II’s fault-tolerant computer

#251
post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It still lives on as a bit of a hard skill in automotive/robotics. As someone who crosses the divide between enterprise web software, and hacking about with embedded automotive bits, I don't really lament that we're not using WCET and Real Time OSes in web applications!

if you ever worked on automotive you know it's bs. since CAN all reliability and predictive nature was out. we now have redundancy everywhere with everything just rebooting all the time. install an aftermarket radio and your ecu will probably reboot every time you press play or something. and that's just "normal".

I didn't experience that but the commercial stuff I worked on was in a heavy industry on J1939, and our bus was isolated from the vehicle to some regard.

Then the stuff I mess with at home is 90s era CAN and it's basically all diagnostics, actually I think these particular cars don't do any control over the bus.

Re: How NASA built Artemis II’s fault-tolerant computer

#252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For errors due to radiation the probability is extremely low, since it would need to flip the same bit at the same time in two different places.

Then why 8 instead of 3?

8 is 2 to the power of 3

Re: How NASA built Artemis II’s fault-tolerant computer

#253
post #233
post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

8khz polling rate mouse and keyboard, 240hz 4K monitor (with Oled to reduce smearing preferably, or it becomes very noticeable), 360hz 1440p, or 480hz 1080p, is current state of the art. You need a decent processor and GPU (especially the high refresh rate monitors as you’re pushing a huge amount data to your display, as only the newest GPUs support the newest display port standard) to run all this, but my Windows de…

That's a good one. I probably should have brought up variance though. These cache-less systems had none. Windows might just decide to index a bunch of stuff and trash your cache, and it runs slow for a bit while loading gigabytes of crap back into memory. When I flip my lightswitch, it's always (perceptibly) the same amount of time until the light comes on. Click a button on the screen? Uh...

Hah, that’s a good point! Unfortunately I have Hue smart bulbs and while they’re extremely convenient and better than most, there is sometimes a slight pause when using my WiFi controlled color schemes to switch between my configured red and daylight modes. What you gain in convenience and accessibility (being able to say “turn off the master bedroom” when I’m tired is amazing) I’ve lost in pure speed and consistency.

Re: How NASA built Artemis II’s fault-tolerant computer

#254
post #3

The quote from the CMU guy about modern Agile and DevOps approaches challenging architectural discipline is a nice way of saying most of us have completely forgotten how to build deterministic systems. Time-triggered Ethernet with strict frame scheduling feels like it's from a parallel universe compared to how we ship software now.

Microsoft fired all QA people ten or fifteen years ago. I'd imagine it's a similar a story: boxed software needed much higher guarantees of correctness. Digital deliver leaves much more room for error, because it leaves room for easier, cheaper fixes.

Re: How NASA built Artemis II’s fault-tolerant computer

#255
post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Time triggered Ethernet is part of aircraft certified data bus and has a deep, decades long history. I believe INRIA did work on this, feeding Airbus maybe. It makes perfect sense when you can design for it. An aircraft is a bounded problem space of inputs and outputs which can have deterministic required minima and then you can build for it, and hopefully even have headroom for extras. Ethernet is such a misnomer fo…

A real squirrel would need acorns, I would assume it's a clockwork squirrel too.

A software squirrel, maybe? https://sqrrl.io :-)

Re: How NASA built Artemis II’s fault-tolerant computer

#256
post #237
post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Somehow the last sentence of your comment caught me as if there's something wrong with it. I don't thing it's wrong, but I think it should be generalised. Free market is an approach to negotiation, analogous to ad-hoc model in computer science, as opposed to client-server model - which matches command economy. There are tons of nuances of course regarding incentives, optimal group sizes, resource constraints etc. Fre…

> Also there's the, often, I suppose, intentional confusion of terms. The free market of the economic theory is not an unregulated market, it's a market of infinitesimal agents with infinitesimal influence of each individual agent upon the whole market, with no out-of-market mechanisms and not even in-market interaction between agents on the same side. Just to expand on this really interesting topic. That's where the…

Can't say I agree on where the pitfall of planned economy begins.

As I see it, planned economy is strictly not a market, and it is not created as an intervention in the market. It's a rigid resource distribution system without on-the-fly negotiation, typically highly optimised, and without slack and any leeway for its agents. It can be optimal in a limited scope for a limited timespan, but it is rigid and doesn't adapt automatically. These are issues that could be overcome in theory with faster reassesment and distribution adjustment, but there is also practical issue that its agents are, in the end, imperfect people, and they have conflicting incentives. The other side of low slack is low resilience, any unforeseen problem has severe consequences, and it creates destructive incentives for agents.

Janos Kornai has a book "Economics of Shortage" (I haven't read all of that, honestly) that, as far as I understand that, says that lack of openly availible resources in planned economies causes agents to bear a risk of not being able to execute more-important-than-usual orders of their superiors that happen on some special ocassions and thus face severe consequences, in case something in that agent's operations breaks. And due to lack of market, agent cannot fix the issue on-the-fly, only in the next planning cycle. That incentivises agents to not execute their day-to-day roles and hoard any goods they have - in order to exchange them on black market for some other goods and favors wheen need will arise - and it will arise as there will be orders from above and something break and go wrong.

> external agents trying to manipulate the market are just that, agents in the market. I tend to think of a market not as a whole economic system at once, but as a subsection of it - in this way that there are essentially multiple categories markets, as in goods market, labor market, etc. In this viewpoint, external agents are often not a part of market. Regulations affe ofct the agents but are not agents themselves. Target financing - the same. Marketing campaign is out-of-market (as in specifically goods market) manipulation on the consumers by producers to change perceived value of producer's product.

I suspect I could be not terminologically correct there, and the existing terminology here is a bit confusing, again. I'd like to call what I understand as free market "pure market", while the free market is what's commonly understood - an unregulated one. The completely free market, I suppose, tends to not be pure in long term due to positive feedbacks causing some of market's participants to be not-infinitesimal and in the end forming a monopoly or an cartel.

> and at that point it requires such a enormous structure of power and control that makes it difficult to fight it (clientelist networks, repressive states, etc).

Of course, replacement of one massive system with another requires enormous amount of power and control. And planned economy concentrates control and decision-making in one place, instead of it being distributed across all agents, thus obviously the planner would be massive.

I am not an economist in any way, not even education, I was just fascinated by the economic failure of USSR and whether it was avoidable in any way since childhood.

Re: How NASA built Artemis II’s fault-tolerant computer

#257
post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What a great visual. I haven't heard that phrase before.

It's a fun image, but I was not my idea. I was playfully referring to this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ashtray_(Or_the_Man_Who_De... Although in this original case the image (that allegedly happened) used to criticize the philopher (Kuhn), so kind of the other side of the coin of what I said above.

Thanks for the context!

An ashtray is such a temporally rooted object, the phrase, "throwing around ashtrays," immediately conjures a bunch of peripheral concrete imagery.

I imagine there will soon be generations of young people who wonder what a tray of ashes was used for and why people used to collect them all over their homes and offices.

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