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EFF launches Age Verification Hub

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Re: EFF launches Age Verification Hub

#251

Post by anon291 »

jacobgkau wrote: post #184
like_any_other wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Age Verification isn't about Kids or Censorship, It's about Surveillance We know this because, instead of putting easy-to-use parental controls on new devices sold (and making it easy to install on old ones) with good defaults [1], they didn't even try that, and went directly for the most privacy-hostile solution. [1] So lazy parents with whatever censorship the government thinks is appropriate for kids, while invo…

Parental control software has existed for decades. It hasn't worked. Over 70% of teenagers Yes, there were other ways of trying to solve the problem. Governments could've mandated explicit websites (which includes a lot of mainstream social media these days) include the RTA rating tag instead of it being a voluntary thing, which social media companies still would've fought; and governments could've also mandated all…

It's also already illegal to send porn to a minor. Porn companies that transmit porn to minors are already committing a sex crime.

Re: EFF launches Age Verification Hub

#252

Post by edgineer »

zamadatix wrote: post #237
pksebben wrote: post #88

This keeps coming up and we keep having the same debates about what Age Verification isn't. For the folks in the back row: Age Verification isn't about Kids or Censorship, It's about Surveillance Age Verification isn't about Kids or Censorship, It's about Surveillance Age Verification isn't about Kids or Censorship, It's about Surveillance Without even reaching for my tinfoil hat, the strategy at work here is clear […

As much as you (and I as well) don't want age verification to involve discussion about kids' access to content because we're more concerned about the surveillance push riding the popularity of that, repeating "it isn't about kids" loudly 3 times doesn't make the (extremely large) group of people pushing age verification for kids disappear. Telling that larger group their interest just isn't part of the conversation a…

I'm sure those people exist, I just never happen to see anything they write online nor meet any of them in real life.

Re: EFF launches Age Verification Hub

#253

Post by Seattle3503 »

pseudalopex wrote: post #199
Seattle3503 wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is only hypothetical for government ID's, but in theory government IDs could provide pairwise pseudonymous identifiers with services. Your ID with a single service is stable, but it is different with each service.

They imagined a scenario where the state ordered 2 companies to identify users. How would replacing 1 company with the state improve this?

What would the state force you to do in this case?

Re: EFF launches Age Verification Hub

#254

Post by prophesi »

Nevermark wrote: post #243

Why don't we have zero-knowledge age verification? One actor verifies ages - and they only need to do so once. Sites give users a key tied to their user account to run by their verifier, who returns another key that attests to their verified age encoded for that specific site, to give back to the site. The site doesn't know anything about the user, but their user login info. The verifier doesn't know anything about w…

I think you're suggesting a centralized actor to verify the age of users which is problematic on multiple accounts. Practicality, privacy, enforcement, liability to coercion/corruption, and so on. This might be a wild take, but I think platforms could do a lot more to help with moderation to prevent child predators. Instead of just being okay with them finding outside avenues to converse with their victims through their platform, maybe use those algorithms to detect and prevent it in the first place, whether or not said child predators are whales for your platform or not.

Re: EFF launches Age Verification Hub

#255

Post by godelski »

zamadatix wrote: post #237
pksebben wrote: post #88

This keeps coming up and we keep having the same debates about what Age Verification isn't. For the folks in the back row: Age Verification isn't about Kids or Censorship, It's about Surveillance Age Verification isn't about Kids or Censorship, It's about Surveillance Age Verification isn't about Kids or Censorship, It's about Surveillance Without even reaching for my tinfoil hat, the strategy at work here is clear […

As much as you (and I as well) don't want age verification to involve discussion about kids' access to content because we're more concerned about the surveillance push riding the popularity of that, repeating "it isn't about kids" loudly 3 times doesn't make the (extremely large) group of people pushing age verification for kids disappear. Telling that larger group their interest just isn't part of the conversation a…

For the folks in the back row:

Age Verification is about Kids and Censorship: to track them and censor them

Age Verification is about Kids: giving it to companies who will keep it as safe as they've kept your identity, email, and other information.

Age Verification is about Kids and Censorship: taking control from you and giving it to corporations and government.

Age Verification is about Kids and Censorship: to keep them on their platforms so they can profit from them

Age Verification isn't just about Kids: it's also about tracking you

I don't know why we want to put children's data online. I don't want cameras in the kids rooms to verify their face, that camera will be used by others. That camera will be used to do the very thing they claim it is to protect against. I don't want the kids online, easily meeting with pedos, pretending to be kids or otherwise. I don't want kids data online for those people to use it to harm them. I don't want kid's data being leaked and exposed forever. To create lasting damage that will follow then the rest of their lives.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. The devil uses this to fool you. Seriously, y'all gonna trust your kids' data with the people in the Epstein list? Why would you let a fox guard the chicken coop?

Re: EFF launches Age Verification Hub

#256

Post by jedberg »

I have a friend attempting to solve this. He's basically creating oauth for age verification. You sign up with his service and verify your age. After that it works similarly to oauth, but instead of return your identity, it just returns your age.

It's not a perfect solution, as he would still know who you are, but it's built in a way where you create a token locally to pass to the site that includes your age, and that site passes it to his site, which verifies the signature. So he knows who you are but not what sites you visit, and the sites know your age but not who you are.

Re: EFF launches Age Verification Hub

#257

Post by godelski »

edgineer wrote: post #252
zamadatix wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As much as you (and I as well) don't want age verification to involve discussion about kids' access to content because we're more concerned about the surveillance push riding the popularity of that, repeating "it isn't about kids" loudly 3 times doesn't make the (extremely large) group of people pushing age verification for kids disappear. Telling that larger group their interest just isn't part of the conversation a…

I'm sure those people exist, I just never happen to see anything they write online nor meet any of them in real life.

We're all in bubbles. But it's good to expand them when you recognize you're in one.

Re: EFF launches Age Verification Hub

#258

Post by downrightmike »

zamadatix wrote: post #237
pksebben wrote: post #88

This keeps coming up and we keep having the same debates about what Age Verification isn't. For the folks in the back row: Age Verification isn't about Kids or Censorship, It's about Surveillance Age Verification isn't about Kids or Censorship, It's about Surveillance Age Verification isn't about Kids or Censorship, It's about Surveillance Without even reaching for my tinfoil hat, the strategy at work here is clear […

As much as you (and I as well) don't want age verification to involve discussion about kids' access to content because we're more concerned about the surveillance push riding the popularity of that, repeating "it isn't about kids" loudly 3 times doesn't make the (extremely large) group of people pushing age verification for kids disappear. Telling that larger group their interest just isn't part of the conversation a…

"group of people pushing age verification for kids disappear."

Parents need to parent then, but the amount that will are still larger than the people who want mass surveillance because they can't be arsed to raise their kids.

If they are too lazy to raise their kids, they don't have the energy to push the nanny state forward.

Re: EFF launches Age Verification Hub

#259

Post by Epa095 »

rlpb wrote: post #11

I'd be OK with an "I am a child" header mandated by law to be respected by service providers (eg. "adult sites" must not permit a client setting the header to proceed). On the client side, mandate that consumer devices that might reasonably be expected to be used by children (every smartphone, tablet, smart TV, etc) have parental controls that set the header. Leave it to parents to set the controls. Perhaps even hold…

It would be possible to make a website which proxies other sites, but strips this header, right (maybe with some added ads)?

If so I would expect such sites to appear, and the only way to secure a child device is to have a whitelist of webpages (to avoid the proxies), putting us back close to where we are today.

Re: EFF launches Age Verification Hub

#260

Post by IlikeKitties »

If you haven't figured out this is a push by the WEF for digital identity and an end of anonymity on the internet you can't be helped. They are LITERALLY saying it out loud https://nitter.net/JimFergusonUK/status/1988514762896855155

Why do you think there's a global push all at once for this? Anyway I'll order a bunch of cheap USB Sticks, load them up with porn and gore and drop them at school yards at night then. If we do that enough we can make using USB Devices require ID Soon enough.

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