Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Bikeshedding, or why I want to build a laptop

geohot.github.io

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

251–260 of 282 posts

Re: Bikeshedding, or why I want to build a laptop

#251

Post by rkomorn »

Yokolos wrote: post #250
dang wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you please not post in the flamewar style to HN? You've done it repeatedly in this thread, unfortunately, and we're trying for the opposite here. If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.

That's unfair. I'm going unfairly called out even though I stand by my beliefs and I'm only trying to defend myself. How are the replies to my comments in any way acceptable and according to HN guidelines??? "Put your money where your mouth is", come on. That's not acceptable and it's provoking. How can you defend bullies like this?

I'm not a mod (and I flagged the comment you had originally replied to so I'm on "your side"), but I'd apply "two wrongs don't make a right" here.

I think the feedback is fair. I'd say just take it (the feedback) and move on.

Re: Bikeshedding, or why I want to build a laptop

#252

Post by forty »

maccard wrote: post #194
hshdhdhj4444 wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The assumption here is that the MacBook is better because of soldering components rather than because Apple simply made a better chip and has a better OS than Windows. Is there a reason to believe that if Apple didn’t solder memory on, it would make the performance/battery worse, as opposed to making the device slightly heavier/bigger?

> The assumption here is that the MacBook is better because of soldering components rather than because Apple simply made a better chip and has a better OS than Windows. That's your assumption - my point is that I don't care as long as it's actually good . The only part I really care about is the battery because it has a limited number of cycles that is shorter than the lifetime of the rest of the components.

The issue is precisely that you don't care, and as a result laptop makers have no incentive to making long lasting repairable laptop and our planet will look like a giant electric waste (not counting the problem will producing the required minerals etc).

If they were required to make things long lasting and repairable, they would put the effort into designing things this way, and you'll probably have laptops as perfect as you require, probably not much more expensive if at all in a few years but also have the required properties to f*ck our planet less.

That's the main issue with our current system, companies are only incentivised to maximize their profits, so they will happily f*ck our planet if they can save 1 cent in r&d on a 4000€ product.

Re: Bikeshedding, or why I want to build a laptop

#253

Post by RealityVoid »

hellcow wrote: post #202
RealityVoid wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electronic devices usually get thrown away because nobody wants them anymore because they are obsolete. Having removable RAM will do you little good if you can only fit ddr3.

That's why you'd want to be able to replace the mainboard, screen, keyboard, speakers, trackpad, etc., and not just the RAM. Like https://shop.mntre.com/products/mnt-reform , but presumably easier for non-technical people to use.

So... A PC then?

Don't get me wrong, I like the approach, but if you want a laptop, it's the wrong tradeoff and not one that 90% of the users will take. Sure, _some_ will choose this, and small companies can do well to sustain themselves but it probably won't do a dent in ewaste numbers and you won't see iphone like adoption numbers, relegating it to just a niche product.

Re: Bikeshedding, or why I want to build a laptop

#254

Post by chrisandchris »

scrollaway wrote: post #93
chrisandchris wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know as a company that you have gone out of the ability to create something if you come up first with name changes of existing products. Looking at you, Office (or whatever your name is today).

Google Workspace hasn’t changed its name in a few years now. Do you think it’s due for a change or has it finally sobered up?

Chances are 50/50 that they forgot that they have this product or they're going to kill it in January.

/s

Re: Bikeshedding, or why I want to build a laptop

#255

Post by naruhodo »

tensegrist wrote: post #123
chungy wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The blog is premised on the idea that Apple and MacBook are not doing fine.

that they're not doing fine software -wise

And nobody else is doing better software wise because Apple is secretive about how to program the hardware. Asahi is not sufficient.

Re: Bikeshedding, or why I want to build a laptop

#257

Post by pta2002 »

johnhamlin wrote: post #29
krick wrote: post #15

I wonder why ThinkPads are not mentioned. It's not like I recommend them (I mean, I use one, but it's not like I've tried most laptops out there, so who I am to judge), but I was under the impression it's still a de-facto Linux laptop standard.

How’s the battery life?

I have an X1 extreme. I’ve never gotten it to last over 2h on Windows. On Linux it can last an hour or so more if I turn off the NVIDIA GPU, but otherwise it’s still abysmal.

Then there’s the stupid BIOS warning that requires you to press ESC for the computer to boot if it’s not plugged in to the official charger, which means that if it ever reboots at night it’ll just keep you awake (because the power management hasn’t been initialized yet so it’s stuck at 100% CPU) until you go press ESC.

Oh and it thermal throttles all the time so the CPU performance is good for a few minutes and then it’s just awful.

Re: Bikeshedding, or why I want to build a laptop

#258

Post by mqus »

fmajid wrote: post #98
krick wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel the same way, but I wouldn't be bold enough to call it dumb. I mean, I assume they know what they are doing. This is very inconvenient for me, as a buyer, but I suppose most companies just aren't Apple, so they throw at us a lot of various stuff hoping that something sticks. And, for that matter, Apple's product line gets more diversified each year too. now it's Air, and Pro, and Max, so I wouldn't bet it won'…

Zbook Ultra G1a 14 makes perfect sense: Z means workstation Book for notebook/laptop format, not desktop Ultra is the line, like Pro in MacBook Pro G1 is the first generation, that way you don't have to wonder a for AMD 14 is the screen diagonal

Great, now I can compare it with other Zsomethings. But as the post shows, thats just one branch of many naming schemes HP employs. Also: This already is a workstation, how could it _not_ be "ultra"? Why the doubling? Or does "workstation" just mean "something I can work with", including office stuff? In that case, I am very interested what other letters they use and what they're for.

Re: Bikeshedding, or why I want to build a laptop

#259

Post by maccard »

forty wrote: post #252
maccard wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The assumption here is that the MacBook is better because of soldering components rather than because Apple simply made a better chip and has a better OS than Windows. That's your assumption - my point is that I don't care as long as it's actually good . The only part I really care about is the battery because it has a limited number of cycles that is shorter than the lifetime of the rest of the components.

The issue is precisely that you don't care, and as a result laptop makers have no incentive to making long lasting repairable laptop and our planet will look like a giant electric waste (not counting the problem will producing the required minerals etc). If they were required to make things long lasting and repairable, they would put the effort into designing things this way, and you'll probably have laptops as perfe…

You're getting all up in arms about a strawman argument that you feel very strongly about. I'

> as a result laptop makers have no incentive to making long lasting repairable laptop and our planet will look like a giant electric waste (not counting the problem will producing the required minerals etc).

And yet pretty much every windows machine on the market right now has user replacable RAM, storage and batteries.

My point is that hardware is not changing at the same pace as it was - a laptop from 2015 with a fresh battery is absolutely perfectly usable in 2025. A laptop from 2005 would be unusable in 2015. An SSD would help you get from 2010 to 2015, but going from 2GB to the chipsets maximum 8GB is going to do nothing for the longetivity of the machine - that 2005 laptop processor is unlikely to even be able to boot a web browser.

Re: Bikeshedding, or why I want to build a laptop

#260

Post by bobbob27 »

pjmlp wrote: post #83
jedbrooke wrote: post #43

> Consumer electronics naming is very simple. Make a good product with a simple name. “iPhone”, “comma”, “Z Fold”. Then every year or two, add one to the number of that product. If it’s a small refresh, you can add a letter after the number. “2 3 3X 4” “4 4s 5 5s 6 …” “2 3 4 5 6 7” Why is this so hard for companies like HP? Oh man I feel this every time there’s a games console launch. I still have no idea what the la…

What to expect, when Microsoft decides to do stupid things like renaming .NET Core into .NET 5, thus everyone that doesn't pay attention to Microsoft world keeps thinking .NET is Windows only, as the .NET Framework was always known as plain .NET in most circles.

Microsoft Teams. Teams (Personal), Teams (Work and School), Teams (New). A year or so ago you night have had all three of these installed at the same time..

and that's AFTER they changed the names of Personal and Work. Before that, you'd have Microsoft Teams and Microsoft Teams. One was purple with a white T and the other was white with a purple T.

If you tried to login with the personal version, it would error-out but not give any indication you may be using the wrong version. Let's be real. NO ONE is using Teams in their personal life. /rant

They're just infuriating on every level when it comes to naming things.

Post reply on HN