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Thoughts on Mechanical Keyboards and the ZSA Moonlander

masteringemacs.org

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Re: Thoughts on Mechanical Keyboards and the ZSA Moonlander

#251

Post by bradgessler »

linsomniac wrote: post #230

I've had a Moonlander for a couple years, and an ErgoDox Ez for 3-4 years before that, and, honestly, I'm looking to move to something else. My biggest issue seems to be that I'm switching between a Macbook and the Moonlander all the time, and the Moonlander I just find myself making too many dumb typos on. In particular, I think the ortholinear layout isn't doing me any favors, and the missing extra keys on the righ…

I changed the layout of my Moonlander's to roughly match that of my MacBook and it works reasonably well.

Re: Thoughts on Mechanical Keyboards and the ZSA Moonlander

#252

Post by blamestross »

The moonlander's firmware approach is the critical feature for me.

Its a customizable ergonomic keyboard that requires zero special software on the host machine. It enables me to use the full features of the keyboard on highly restricted work machines.

I also bounce operating systems a lot, so I programmed multiple layers (and light color pallets) to unify all the different os keymaps. If I am on a mac, hit the useless red button until the keyboard turns green. On windows, until it turns blue. On debian, until it turns red. Then just go.

Its a lot of work to setup initially, but then it works everywhere forever.

Re: Thoughts on Mechanical Keyboards and the ZSA Moonlander

#253

Post by CarVac »

My opinion on column stagger ergo keyboards: everyone's hands differ, and there is no one-size-fits-all.

The amount of pinky stagger and the thumb cluster position are critically important for comfort.

Personally I use a handwired Mitosis (the original Mitosis was unreliable for me but the layout perfect).

Ergodox is awful for me, particularly the reaching needed to use the thumb cluster.

Re: Thoughts on Mechanical Keyboards and the ZSA Moonlander

#254

Post by babblingfish »

blamestross wrote: post #252

The moonlander's firmware approach is the critical feature for me. Its a customizable ergonomic keyboard that requires zero special software on the host machine. It enables me to use the full features of the keyboard on highly restricted work machines. I also bounce operating systems a lot, so I programmed multiple layers (and light color pallets) to unify all the different os keymaps. If I am on a mac, hit the usele…

I've considered doing this with my Moonlander, but it always seemed like too much effort. Do you have basically use a separate layer for each OS?

Re: Thoughts on Mechanical Keyboards and the ZSA Moonlander

#255

Post by zie »

sorahn wrote: post #109
zie wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might try the UHK 80: https://ultimatehackingkeyboard.com/uhk80 I have the UHK 60 and I really like it, except as you mentioned no function keys. The software is pretty good, includes a little DSL and you can do pretty much anything you want.

I couldn't quite go for the 60%, but I have friends with the UHK60 and I really liked it as a keyboard. I popped for the 80 as soon as the shipping times caught up to real time. It's a fantastic keyboard. I haven't gotten any of the clusters for it yet, but I'm very happy with my purchase.

Ya, mine is an original UHK60 v1 from years and years ago. It still holds up great.

I hope they make a UHK 110 key. I want all the keys.

Right now it's not worth the upgrade to me from the 60 to the 80. but I'd totally upgrade for a 101/110/120 or whatever keys.

Modes and multiple keys to do one thing is fine, but it's not as nice as just having a dedicated key. Which is why I want all the keys.

Re: Thoughts on Mechanical Keyboards and the ZSA Moonlander

#256

Post by lawn »

CarVac wrote: post #253

My opinion on column stagger ergo keyboards: everyone's hands differ, and there is no one-size-fits-all. The amount of pinky stagger and the thumb cluster position are critically important for comfort. Personally I use a handwired Mitosis (the original Mitosis was unreliable for me but the layout perfect). Ergodox is awful for me, particularly the reaching needed to use the thumb cluster.

I wholeheartedly agree. The Ergodox is god-damned horrible for me and I've struggled a lot to find a good thumb cluster.

The Ferris comes close but in the end I configured and 3D printed my own keyboard, tailored specifically for me:

https://www.jonashietala.se/blog/2024/11/26/building_my_ulti...

Re: Thoughts on Mechanical Keyboards and the ZSA Moonlander

#257

Post by alfalfasprout »

steinso wrote: post #236
linsomniac wrote: post #230

I've had a Moonlander for a couple years, and an ErgoDox Ez for 3-4 years before that, and, honestly, I'm looking to move to something else. My biggest issue seems to be that I'm switching between a Macbook and the Moonlander all the time, and the Moonlander I just find myself making too many dumb typos on. In particular, I think the ortholinear layout isn't doing me any favors, and the missing extra keys on the righ…

Could not agree more, it's frustrating that there seems to be such a focus on the 'mechanical' aspect of these keyboards instead of the ergonomic and programmable which are the real stars. I would love just a low profile programmable keyboard with 5 individual keys instead of the long space bar. That would tick all my boxes.

You could explore a different paradigm entirely. The svalboard (https://svalboard.com/) is the modern evolution of the datahands and goes much further than mere thumb clusters and programmable firmware.

Really great and active community too!

Re: Thoughts on Mechanical Keyboards and the ZSA Moonlander

#258

Post by redelbee »

First off, I appreciate the thorough explanation and review of the ZSA Moonlander. That said, I’m here to discuss the “visual ergonomics” of this post.

Why is justified text so bad on the web? And why do people still use it, despite how terrible it looks? When I was in journalism school I learned how to properly justify text with line breaks, tracking, and other techniques to make sure we didn’t have “rivers” of blank space through the text or other hard-to-read layouts. Is there no way to achieve the same readable outcome today with CSS, or otherwise?

If not, I beg of you: Please don’t use justified text on the web!

Re: Thoughts on Mechanical Keyboards and the ZSA Moonlander

#259

Post by cosmic_cheese »

linsomniac wrote: post #230

I've had a Moonlander for a couple years, and an ErgoDox Ez for 3-4 years before that, and, honestly, I'm looking to move to something else. My biggest issue seems to be that I'm switching between a Macbook and the Moonlander all the time, and the Moonlander I just find myself making too many dumb typos on. In particular, I think the ortholinear layout isn't doing me any favors, and the missing extra keys on the righ…

I've made a point of staying away from more radically different layouts precisely because I live in a reality where use of laptop keyboards is frequent and dragging an external board around isn't really practical.

It would be nice if laptop manufacturers standardized on a modular keyboard deck design, making it viable to do small-batch group buys of replacement decks with relatively esoteric layouts. This wouldn't cover every possible layout due to size constraints but it'd be a marked improvement.

Re: Thoughts on Mechanical Keyboards and the ZSA Moonlander

#260

Post by Nicholas_C »

cosmic_cheese wrote: post #259
linsomniac wrote: post #230

I've had a Moonlander for a couple years, and an ErgoDox Ez for 3-4 years before that, and, honestly, I'm looking to move to something else. My biggest issue seems to be that I'm switching between a Macbook and the Moonlander all the time, and the Moonlander I just find myself making too many dumb typos on. In particular, I think the ortholinear layout isn't doing me any favors, and the missing extra keys on the righ…

I've made a point of staying away from more radically different layouts precisely because I live in a reality where use of laptop keyboards is frequent and dragging an external board around isn't really practical. It would be nice if laptop manufacturers standardized on a modular keyboard deck design, making it viable to do small-batch group buys of replacement decks with relatively esoteric layouts. This wouldn't co…

My work laptop and personal laptop are the same model for this reason. Switching between two different keyboard layouts is very frustrating.
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