NSF has suspended Terry Tao's grant • Hacker News Board

Re: NSF has suspended Terry Tao's grant

#251

Post by throwaway290 » Fri, Aug 01, 2025, 2:16 PM UTC

hackyhacky wrote: post #243

throwaway290 wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a strawman. Of course there is free speech. It doesn't mean it's okay to talk on the phone in a cinema or recite the Bible aloud during a math lecture. It doesn't mean it's fair play to shout obscenities on the train and spit on people. Idk about US but there is a thing called "verbal abuse" and police is 100% callable for that. That out of the way so how about hostile environment for students again? I was do…

Shouting obscenities on the train, as well as hate speech broadly, are constitutionally protected under the first amendment. Creating a hostile environment for students based on their religion would violate the Civil Rights Act. However, there is a paucity of evidence that the universities did that. Allowing protests probably isn't sufficient, especially when prohibiting those same protests would be unconstitutional.…

Okay so if I get it correctly they could be kicked out like in the cinema or not, because like I assume regardless of free speech there are rules, but this "cinema" cannot be prosecuted by US gov for NOT kicking a noisy jerk out of it because then it becomes a free speech thing. If taking away grants counts as prosecution? I guess that makes sense.

Re: NSF has suspended Terry Tao's grant

#252

Post by maleldil » Fri, Aug 01, 2025, 2:17 PM UTC

hermitcrab wrote: post #185

sitkack wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/christian-zionism-israel-anti...

I've never really understood the relationship between the US and Israel. The US gives Israel pretty much whatever it wants and in return the US gets ... nothing? Israel even (deliberately?) attacked a US ship during the 6 day war, with little (if any) consequences: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident >While millions of American evangelical Christians have long been fervent supporters of the Jewish stat…

The main reason is geopolitics. Israel is an ally in the Middle East, a key region to US foreign policy.

Re: NSF has suspended Terry Tao's grant

#253

Post by rahimnathwani » Fri, Aug 01, 2025, 2:18 PM UTC

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #244

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

The reason I downvoted the comment is that it's engaged in excuse-making for an authoritarian extortion campaign. I acknowledge and strongly oppose UCLA's racial discrimination in hiring, and if the Department of Education sent them a letter demanding they knock it off or face a lawfully justified penalty I'd have absolutely no concerns about that. Over here in the real world, an aspiring dictator has destroyed the D…

How did my comment engage in 'excuse-making'?

I specifically called out that I was interested in understanding people's rationale for disagreeing with the actions taken by the federal government.

From your comment, it seems like you're mostly in the (B) camp, i.e. wrong enforcement method. Maybe also (C) due to questionable motive for enforcement. Have I understood correctly?

Re: NSF has suspended Terry Tao's grant

#254

Post by maleldil » Fri, Aug 01, 2025, 2:22 PM UTC

narcissism889 wrote: post #190

[flagged]

> Israel is a multiethnic country that achieves high standards of living

Ask the Arabs who live in the country if their standard of living is the same as the rest.

Re: NSF has suspended Terry Tao's grant

#255

Post by rahimnathwani » Fri, Aug 01, 2025, 2:25 PM UTC

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #220

rahimnathwani wrote: post #197

I expect most people here are (like me) admirers of Terence Tao, and fans of his work. But, if UCLA is indeed an institution that routinely violate civil rights law, would we still want our taxes to fund it? For those objecting to any reduction in federal funding, is this because: A) You believe UCLA complies with civil rights law (perhaps with small, isolated exceptions that are driven not by policy but by rogue emp…

[flagged]

I suspect most negative reactions would be some combo of:

- it's off topic to talk about racial discrimination in hiring and admissions, when OP is about how a group is treated on campus

- Terence Tao's research funding shouldn't be affected by politics, and it's irrelevant that he happens to work for UCLA

- dislike the current administration's positions and methods in general

- don't like this particular action, so any attempt to see good in it is bad

Re: NSF has suspended Terry Tao's grant

#256

Post by hermitcrab » Fri, Aug 01, 2025, 2:26 PM UTC

maleldil wrote: post #252

hermitcrab wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never really understood the relationship between the US and Israel. The US gives Israel pretty much whatever it wants and in return the US gets ... nothing? Israel even (deliberately?) attacked a US ship during the 6 day war, with little (if any) consequences: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident >While millions of American evangelical Christians have long been fervent supporters of the Jewish stat…

The main reason is geopolitics. Israel is an ally in the Middle East, a key region to US foreign policy.

So is Saudi Arabia. The US doesn't have such a one-sided relationship with them, as far as I can see.

Re: NSF has suspended Terry Tao's grant

#257

Post by lcnPylGDnU4H9OF » Fri, Aug 01, 2025, 2:27 PM UTC

throwaway290 wrote: post #235

hackyhacky wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it's false. Students have a first amendment right to express opinions, even anti-Zionist ones. The administration is using baseless charges of antisemitism as a cudgel to extract fealty and concessions from universities, which they see as opponents of their party.

This is a strawman. Of course there is free speech. It doesn't mean it's okay to talk on the phone in a cinema or recite the Bible aloud during a math lecture. It doesn't mean it's fair play to shout obscenities on the train and spit on people. Idk about US but there is a thing called "verbal abuse" and police is 100% callable for that. That out of the way so how about hostile environment for students again? I was do…

> I was downvoted for asking a question and this did not answer it.

I am 100% sure your comment was downvoted for this sentence:

> I'm not in the US but I heard pretty interesting things about what was happening in universities following Oct 7.

People here don’t like propaganda-fueled speculation. The commenter also literally answered your question. You asked if it was meant to be implied as false and they said yes.

Re: NSF has suspended Terry Tao's grant

#258

Post by pklausler » Fri, Aug 01, 2025, 2:27 PM UTC

cmrdporcupine wrote: post #215

littlestymaar wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For people despising the Muslim world, those people are working hard to reproduce their fate: going from the most enlightened place on earth to religious obscurantism.

I don't know why people keep painting this conjuncture as some sort of aberration in American history. Intolerance and domination of religion and conservative ideological positions over the state and public sphere is actually the norm, not the exception, if you look back on the 20th century history. From the 60s through the 90s is the exception, really. For example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bertrand_Russell_…

One of my earliest memories was staying up late on a Sunday night to see Neil and Buzz on the moon. Now, in the same country that could once put them there, I have to defend that it even happened. Basic health measures like pasteurization and vaccination are under direct attack. It's been a long shitty decline into madness, and it's just accelerating.

Re: NSF has suspended Terry Tao's grant

#259

Post by oceansky » Fri, Aug 01, 2025, 2:29 PM UTC

linotype wrote: post #200

oceansky wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would say at least a century

If an alliance decades in the making can be undone in six months it wasn’t much of an alliance in the first place. Just a bunch of countries subsidizing their defense budgets off the backs of the poor and middle class in the US (NATO).

Destroying is much easier than building something, including alliances, trust and deals.

Re: NSF has suspended Terry Tao's grant

#260

Post by SpicyLemonZest » Fri, Aug 01, 2025, 2:30 PM UTC

rahimnathwani wrote: post #253

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason I downvoted the comment is that it's engaged in excuse-making for an authoritarian extortion campaign. I acknowledge and strongly oppose UCLA's racial discrimination in hiring, and if the Department of Education sent them a letter demanding they knock it off or face a lawfully justified penalty I'd have absolutely no concerns about that. Over here in the real world, an aspiring dictator has destroyed the D…

How did my comment engage in 'excuse-making'? I specifically called out that I was interested in understanding people's rationale for disagreeing with the actions taken by the federal government. From your comment, it seems like you're mostly in the (B) camp, i.e. wrong enforcement method. Maybe also (C) due to questionable motive for enforcement. Have I understood correctly?

I would say (B) captures my position pretty precisely, yes. Perhaps I've been too radicalized, because it's very hard for me to credit the idea that (B) is even possible to disagree with.