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Gemini 2.5 Deep Think

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251–259 of 259 posts

Re: Gemini 2.5 Deep Think

#251
post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

wheee, great way to lock in incumbents even more or lock out the EU from startups

Welcome to the lovely world of regulation, enjoy your stay.

If that’s the price to pay avoid poisoning myself with food to name only one thing that’s maybe not that bad.

Re: Gemini 2.5 Deep Think

#252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

but if the less strong model has low false positives you can just route them in order of strength

That's a very big "if".

I very much think a lot of false positives is caused by incentives to maximize score where incorrect answers are not penalized

Re: Gemini 2.5 Deep Think

#253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm, I needed Claude 4’s help to parse your response. The critique was not too kind to your abbreviated arguments that current systems are not able to gauge the complexity of a prompt and the resources needed to address a question.

It feels like the rant of someone upset that their decades of formal logic approach to AI become a dead end. I see this semi-regularly: futile attempts at handwaving away the obvious intelligence by some formal argument that is either irrelevant or inapplicable. Everything from thermodynamics — which applies to human brains too — to information theory. Grey-bearded academics clinging to anything that might float to r…

I usually ignore ad hominem attacks but I am trying to convey a kindness here.

Who do you think is going to be successful, those who realize the limitations and strength of a system and leverage them, or those who are complacent, with a unwarranted self-satisfaction accompanied by unawareness of actual risks or deficiencies of a particular system?

IMHO they are always going to be too complex to know everything about a models of this size, but there are areas we do know their limits or the limits of computation in general.

But feel free to stay on your high horse and call people names and see how well that works out for you.

Re: Gemini 2.5 Deep Think

#254

I find it interesting, how OpenAI came out with a $200 plan, Anthropic did $100 and $200, then Gemini ups it to $250, and now Grok is at $300. OpenAI is the only one that says "practically unlimited" and I have never hit any limit on my ChatGPT Pro plan. I hit limits on Claude Max (both plans) several times. Why are these companies not upfront about what the limits are?

Per-usage pricing discourages use which limits how critical a service can be to your life or workflow. These companies want you to rely on the service such that you’ll pay the price. One customer might use it once a day and find the price reasonable; another may use it 10 times a day and still find the price reasonable. This kind of broad pricing allows for this variation.

Re: Gemini 2.5 Deep Think

#255
post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 99% of programming is repetitive plumbing Even IF that were true (and I'd argue that it is NOT, and it's people who believe that and act that way who produce the tangled messes of spiderweb code that are utterly opaque to public searches and AI analysis -- the supposed "1%"), if even as low as 1% of the code I interacted with was the kind of code that required really deep thought and analysis, it could easily ballo…

> Even IF that were true (and I'd argue that it is NOT) Can you share what these "hard problems" are that > 1% of developers are working on?

Even if most of the code you write is solving repetitive plumbing tasks, today's models are incredibly bad at API design taste. IMO designing software in a way that minimizes side effects and is easy to change and test is more than 1% of software engineering.

Lately most of the code I write has been through LLMs and I find them an enormous productivity booster overall, but despite the benchmarks they're not expert human level quite yet, and they need a LOT of coaxing to produce production quality code.

As far as things LLMs are bad at, I think it's mainly the long tail. I'm not sure there's one singular thing that >1% of programmers work on that LLMs suck at, but I think there are thousands of different weird sub-specialties that almost no one is working on and very little public code exists for, thus LLMs are not good at them yet.

Re: Gemini 2.5 Deep Think

#257
post #57

Been using Gemini for a few months, somehow it's gotten much, much worse in that time. Hallucinations are very common, and it will argue with you when you point it out. So, don't have much confidence.

Is the problem mainly with tool use ? and are you using it through AI studio or through the API ?. I've found that it hallucinates tool use for tools that aren't available and then gets very confident about the results.

Via the chat prompt mostly, and sometimes via Copilot. It was quoting me sources and links that didn't exist, and when I told it the links were wrong it doubled down forever, no matter how hard I tried to tell it otherwise. Even sent screenshots, etc.

Kinda just got stuck in a self-confident loop that time. Other times the output is just far worse than Claude for similar use cases, where a couple months back it was stronger, at least in my subjective experience.

Re: Gemini 2.5 Deep Think

#258
post #57

Been using Gemini for a few months, somehow it's gotten much, much worse in that time. Hallucinations are very common, and it will argue with you when you point it out. So, don't have much confidence.

I feel the same, but cannot measure the effect in any context benchmark like fiction.livebench. Are they aggressively quantizing, or are our expectations silently increasing ?

Yeah, it's hard to measure. Not sure about our expectations, though I recall way better output when I first started using Gemini 2.5 vs now. It seems to be stupider and more headstrong somehow?

Re: Gemini 2.5 Deep Think

#259
post #223
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience with chat, Flash has gotten much, much better. It's my go-to model even though I'm paying for Pro. Pro is frustrating because it too often won't search to find current information, and just gives stale results from before its training cutoff. Flash doesn't do this much anymore. For coding I use Pro in Gemini CLI. It is amazing at coding, but I'm actually using it more to write design docs, decomp mul…

interesting out of all "thinking models," I struggle with Gemini the most for coding. Just can't make it perform. I feel like they silently nerfed it over the last months.

It does feel worse. I've swapped to Claude and it's massively better for my tasks. Jules just released so I'll see if that's useful.
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