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Signs of autism could be encoded in the way you walk

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Re: Signs of autism could be encoded in the way you walk

#251

Post by dukeyukey »

rixed wrote: post #243
TrnsltLife wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is, we are animals, even though we are divine offspring as well. We have an ability to moderate our behavior to a degree, but we are also governed by physiological instinct. Try making inappropriate eye contact with a human male. You'll probably live to make it to the next experiment, even if you do get punched. Now try it with a gorilla or chimp. Sexual cues, hunger, aggression/submission postures and re…

Your point is unclear to me. Are we like chimps, or are we not?

Yes and no.

The instinct is still there. Of course it is. We can override it in a way other creatures probably can't, but expecting people to not be influenced by instinct and such is a non-starter.

Re: Signs of autism could be encoded in the way you walk

#252

Post by cardanome »

hirvi74 wrote: post #247
cardanome wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you've got autism and the biggest thing that stands out is the way you walk... I don't think dragging a kid to a doctor to be told they're not normal is really all that beneficial. There are very strict criteria on how people are to be diagnosed. More importantly you are NOT getting diagnosed if you are just happy and don't need any help. You can NOT be diagnosed with autism without any support needs. Same as yo…

> "Everyone else seems to know when to say the right thing at the right time but you don't. You are some weird alien that does not belong. You try to memorize things to say, copy how other people act, it works but the mask often slips. You must be hyper-vigilant in every social situation to not let the real you slip out. It becomes so automatic that you don't even remember who you are anymore. It is exhausting, so ex…

> This is more of an Autism issue, no?

Yeah, first paragraph was more autism, the other more ADHD.

Personally, ADHD helps me make friends but also makes me not that great at keeping them. People for sure can experience some social difficulty because of ADHD. Pure impulse control and high energy can also be regarded quite negatively.

But in the right context people with ADHD can indeed shine socially.

> Everyone is different, but the data surrounding therapy and coaching for ADHD without medication does not really instill confidence in me.

Yes, good therapists are hard to find so I am not surprised you had bad experiences. I did not really have much luck myself but still generally urge people to give them a shot.

Personally, coaching was a game changer for me. It is not the same as therapy. The main point is you are talking through your problems with someone who has ADHD themselves. They know what it is to have ADHD, they have coached countless people with ADHD. They know what works and what does not.

They help you setting realistic and measurable goals and guide you towards reaching them. It is much more outcome and solution focused which can appeal to people more critical towards traditional therapy. Though coaching is also much less regulated so one also needs to careful to find someone decent.

If you haven't tried, you might want to give it a shot. Anyway, I hope you find something that helps you.

Re: Signs of autism could be encoded in the way you walk

#253

Post by grayfaced »

KyleJune wrote: post #38

Another difference that I believe is common is how your arms move when you walk. I was diagnosed at a young age. I found out I didn't swing my arms normally when walking after someone made fun of me for it in high school. I had to consciously think about swinging my arms for a while to figure out how to do it right. I still catch myself sometimes not swinging my arms correctly when walking or one of my arms resting a…

Never diagnosed but have suspicions and this describes me. I had comments earlier on in life but later I joined the Army. There is a lot of marching and I was frequently told to "swing my arms naturally". Other actions told to "act normal", very frustrating because my normal/natural is what they saw as a problem. So I would try to figure out what normal is and when I would try to emulate, they would tell me I'm thinking about it too much.

Re: Signs of autism could be encoded in the way you walk

#254

Post by strken »

cardanome wrote: post #197
strken wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes, neurodivergence can only be diagnosed based on how you work on the inside. I don't think this is exactly true. We don't involuntarily commit people to psych wards after a long and complicated investigation to understand their mental state. Diagnoses can be made extremely quickly and with little understanding of the interior state of a patient. > Both autism are ADHD are vastly under-diagnosed especially in wom…

> because our diagnostic threshold for tallness has lowered? The threshold for being diagnosed as autistic has increased in recent years. As Asperger is not a separate diagnosis anymore but is part of ASD, some people that might have gotten an Asperger diagnosis would not get an ASD diagnosis today. Again, a diagnosis requires that you have care needs. If you don't, you will not be diagnosed. There is no slippery slo…

> Again, a diagnosis requires that you have care needs. If you don't, you will not be diagnosed. There is no slippery slope of lowering standards.

I don't understand how a slippery slope of lowering standards and not diagnosing anyone unless they have care needs are mutually exclusive. Our standard of care for basically everything has increased. I think you and I both agree that autistic people in the 1960s were less well cared for than in the 1990s, and that treatment has further improved today.

> There have always been neurodivergent people. Not long ago, here in Germany autistic children were systematically murdered during the Nazi regime...The difference is that neurodivergent people don't have to hide anymore as much. We finally have at least a bit of a voice.

This is interesting, because I agree with every individual statement, but it's still not supporting evidence for a change in diagnostic threshold.

Re: Signs of autism could be encoded in the way you walk

#255

Post by throwawaymaths »

ghushn3 wrote: post #104
throwawaymaths wrote: post #95

Isn't walking on the balls of your feet just "good athleticism"?

Most athletes I'm aware of allow their heels to touch the ground. Unless you are aware of a bunch of athletes that walk around like velociraptors, and if you are, please share!

weightlifting yes, but not most track and field. It's pretty common for dancers to say "you should be able to slip a sheet of paper under the heel" for example. Pretty sure that's the case in tennis too.

here's a stock photo of a runner:

https://images.stockcake.com/public/7/1/2/7124d219-0531-40c1...

and here's one of volleyball:

https://www.games-eshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/web.s...

Re: Signs of autism could be encoded in the way you walk

#256

Post by forgotoldacc »

cardanome wrote: post #194
forgotoldacc wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hear this a lot but also know a lot of people who were put on meds when they were young and didn't really understand what was going on. I also have an adult friend put on an antipsychotic to treat their moderate depression. They went through horrifying side effects while doctors kept telling them to stick with it. They're going through even more horrifying side effects during the third week of their withdrawal. The…

> to treat their moderate depression. I criticized depression being too easily diagnosed myself in the post above. Autism and ADHD are clearly underdiagnosed. I have posted some sources here: https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=cardanome#44586532 Maybe depression meds are given too easily. Not my area of expertise. Might also specific to the US. Getting medication here in Germany seems to be much harder. However,…

> We were ignorant of many things in the 90s.

Will people 30 years from now say we were enlightened in the 2020s? Or will we look back at 1/6 being on psychiatric medication as being a bit strange?

Doctors also used to give out antibiotics for any illness, now we realize a more targeted approach is much, much better since most illnesses not only don't need antibiotics, but they can make problems worse when improperly prescribed. And I only saw talk of this go mainstream within the past 15 years.

Re: Signs of autism could be encoded in the way you walk

#257

Post by shitpostbot »

john01dav wrote: post #155
klipt wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess the question is why did we start labeling slightly socially awkward people as the same category as the people you describe in the first place?

The social protocol that low support needs autistic people use is similar to the social protocol that some higher (meaning those who can communicate) support needs autistic people use. The fundamental difference in my opinion (which is primarily formed from fairly extensive personal experience and thinking about it) is that autistic communication is fundamentally collaborative, while allistic communication is fundame…

[dead]

Re: Signs of autism could be encoded in the way you walk

#258

Post by rixed »

dukeyukey wrote: post #251
rixed wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your point is unclear to me. Are we like chimps, or are we not?

Yes and no. The instinct is still there. Of course it is. We can override it in a way other creatures probably can't, but expecting people to not be influenced by instinct and such is a non-starter.

The baseline for human behavior is set by expectations. Some tens of thousand years ago we also had the instinct to savagely kill whoever lived in the nearby village.

Re: Signs of autism could be encoded in the way you walk

#259

Post by staticman2 »

mvieira38 wrote: post #242
CalRobert wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would that not have been called Asperger’s in the past?

It would, depending on some factors. The false belief that there were fewer female aspies was pervasive, for example, and that was troublesome for many girls. Anyway, I suspect "in the past" is further in the past than you think: the distinction between Asperger's and ASD has been officially ditched by the medical community for 12 years now, at least insofar as the DSM represents consensus.

>The false belief that there were fewer female aspies was pervasive, for example, and that was troublesome for many girls.

I'm gonna push back on this. There isn't an objective way to diagnose someone with autism like there is with, say, a vitamin B deficiency.

What we do know is the medical community continues to diagnose boys with this condition at a much higher rate than girls.

This would not appear to imply a "false" belief.

Re: Signs of autism could be encoded in the way you walk

#260

Post by Shaanie »

rixed wrote: post #258
dukeyukey wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes and no. The instinct is still there. Of course it is. We can override it in a way other creatures probably can't, but expecting people to not be influenced by instinct and such is a non-starter.

The baseline for human behavior is set by expectations. Some tens of thousand years ago we also had the instinct to savagely kill whoever lived in the nearby village.

Did we though, or did we make a calculated decision that in a place with limited resources it'd be better for us to eliminate the competition?
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