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Menstrual tracking app data is gold mine for advertisers that risks women safety

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Re: Menstrual tracking app data is gold mine for advertisers that risks women safety

#251

Post by creaturemachine »

crazygringo wrote: post #127
kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #89

They don't need apps to do this. I sat in a meeting with a data broker in 1998 where one of their managers was chuffed that they could determine menstrual cycles by analyzing purchasing records. And it wasn't hygiene products. Various foods and other spending patterns pop out after a 28-day correlation over groups of women that are artificially "synced" into cohort groups. This invasiveness will continue so long as t…

Can you elaborate? Because even with hygiene products, people buy them before they need them and stock up. And with food, you're often shopping for a week and for the whole family. You put things on a shopping list and don't buy them the same day you're using them, or even the same week. I suspect that even if the manager thought they could determine it, their actual "results" were entirely random. After all, how is…

You think the data brokers aren't aware of varying spending habits? You might be surprised to learn the number of people living day-to-day, cheque-to-cheque who don't have the ability to stock up on much of anything. These are the consumers who are "ripe for the picking" in marketer's eyes. Back in the late 90's this would have been much harder too, probably working with not much more than cash register receipts.

Re: Menstrual tracking app data is gold mine for advertisers that risks women safety

#252

Post by kstrauser »

crazygringo wrote: post #127
kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #89

They don't need apps to do this. I sat in a meeting with a data broker in 1998 where one of their managers was chuffed that they could determine menstrual cycles by analyzing purchasing records. And it wasn't hygiene products. Various foods and other spending patterns pop out after a 28-day correlation over groups of women that are artificially "synced" into cohort groups. This invasiveness will continue so long as t…

Can you elaborate? Because even with hygiene products, people buy them before they need them and stock up. And with food, you're often shopping for a week and for the whole family. You put things on a shopping list and don't buy them the same day you're using them, or even the same week. I suspect that even if the manager thought they could determine it, their actual "results" were entirely random. After all, how is…

From an advertising POV, isn’t that even better? Then they’d know when to advertise to someone to increase sales.

That is, the marketers wouldn’t actually care about a woman’s cycle, but at which points they could monetize it.

(Good lord, I need a shower after just typing that.)

Re: Menstrual tracking app data is gold mine for advertisers that risks women safety

#253

Post by jedimastert »

giantg2 wrote: post #237
jedimastert wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Third paragraph: > The report’s authors caution that cycle tracking app (CTA) data in the wrong hands could result in risks to job prospects, workplace monitoring, health insurance discrimination and cyberstalking – and limit access to abortion. Did you miss it or are you disagreeing with these being a threat?

The cyberstalking is the most applicable, but I dont see what the menstral data would provide vs not having the mentstral data. A name and address could present a potential threat, but knowing which days someone is bleeding one doesn't seem to be useful in attacking someone unless you believe it makes them a weaker target or something. The others aren't about safety. The one about restricting abortion is a false attr…

> knowing which days someone is bleeding one doesn't seem to be useful in attacking someone unless you believe it makes them a weaker target or something.

I have other things to say here but immediately this is a wildly gross and sexist way to phrase this.

> The others aren't about safety

> risks to job prospects, workplace monitoring, health insurance discrimination

A threat to livelihood and proper health care is a threat to safety, and the fact that you don't recognize that should hopefully trigger some amount of self-reflection.

Beyond that the fact that you can't make the really simple connection between knowing someone's menstrual cycle and knowing their pregnancy status means I deeply hope you take some time to self-reflect and maybe consider that you don't quite have the tools to engage in a nuance conversation about this and should instead take some time to listen to others

Re: Menstrual tracking app data is gold mine for advertisers that risks women safety

#254

Post by titusjohnson »

crazygringo wrote: post #127
kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #89

They don't need apps to do this. I sat in a meeting with a data broker in 1998 where one of their managers was chuffed that they could determine menstrual cycles by analyzing purchasing records. And it wasn't hygiene products. Various foods and other spending patterns pop out after a 28-day correlation over groups of women that are artificially "synced" into cohort groups. This invasiveness will continue so long as t…

Can you elaborate? Because even with hygiene products, people buy them before they need them and stock up. And with food, you're often shopping for a week and for the whole family. You put things on a shopping list and don't buy them the same day you're using them, or even the same week. I suspect that even if the manager thought they could determine it, their actual "results" were entirely random. After all, how is…

> Because even with hygiene products, people buy them before they need them and stock up.

One would think so, but in my experience this is not the case on average. Of the half-dozen long term relationships I've had, only 1 partner was ever prepared for the monthly inevitable. For everyone else it was always treated as a surprise. Suggesting to my current partner that she stock up on the products she just used was dismissed with an "oh I don't need that stuff for weeks".

The trope of guys not wanting to go get tampons, or uncomfortably navigating the feminine hygiene isle, did not just appear out of nowhere.

Re: Menstrual tracking app data is gold mine for advertisers that risks women safety

#255

Post by bluGill »

crazygringo wrote: post #127
kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #89

They don't need apps to do this. I sat in a meeting with a data broker in 1998 where one of their managers was chuffed that they could determine menstrual cycles by analyzing purchasing records. And it wasn't hygiene products. Various foods and other spending patterns pop out after a 28-day correlation over groups of women that are artificially "synced" into cohort groups. This invasiveness will continue so long as t…

Can you elaborate? Because even with hygiene products, people buy them before they need them and stock up. And with food, you're often shopping for a week and for the whole family. You put things on a shopping list and don't buy them the same day you're using them, or even the same week. I suspect that even if the manager thought they could determine it, their actual "results" were entirely random. After all, how is…

While I expect most women buy in advance, I expect they also don't buy enough and so are out there mid-period at least some of the time. Their cycles also affect their buying patterns, so even women who are stocking up are more likely to buy differently in different parts of the cycle.

The real question is what does the manager do with the data. Across a city on any given day there are about the same number of women in every day of their cycle so it isn't like they are marking up pads on the 25th-28th day of the month to get women who didn't stock up. As such I don't think this data is useful, what is useful is when they discover a women missed her cycle and thus needs to get ads for pregnancy wear in a couple months. Since that is their need for data, the fact that it is noisy and not very accurate is still close enough.

That said, they probably are more accurate than you would expect despite all the noise. Not 100% accurate, but being greater than 50% accurate is a lot better than chance and should be obtainable.

Re: Menstrual tracking app data is gold mine for advertisers that risks women safety

#256

Post by tartoran »

jajko wrote: post #214

One of reasons I am underwhelmed by all the smart sport watches. When eventually their DBs get hacked or they sell data willingly, I dont want my employer to see that I was running in the forest during lunch time, or my health insurance to see any circulatory anomaly if I had any. Fuck that, I will start ignoring that few years before retirement, not a second earlier. Its a shame, and I know people like me wont bend…

We detected an anomaly in your circulatory system. Your insurance premium has now been increased.

Further advisory from BioMon Sentinel Node 7: Irregular fluctuations in hemodynamic integrity suggest low compliance with your prescribed wellness protocol. Molecular telemetry indicates caffeine saturation at 347% above neural-optimal threshold. Risk cluster escalation: Tier Sigma-4.

Your vitals have been submitted to the Actuarial Nexus. A claim adjustment algorithm is currently rewriting your financial destiny.

Re: Menstrual tracking app data is gold mine for advertisers that risks women safety

#257

Post by [deleted] »

duxup wrote: post #157

The article doesn't define what exactly they mean by "risks women safety". I don't buy into the idea that all or any advertising is a "safety" issue if that is where they're going. I think there's a very weird type of patronizing that goes on where suddenly we fear for everyone's ability to deal with advertising as if they've got no self control or agency ...

[deleted]

Re: Menstrual tracking app data is gold mine for advertisers that risks women safety

#258

Post by jedimastert »

giantg2 wrote: post #246
vinckr wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the most obvious is that abortions are illegal in the US and you can monitor that status through the app. So in extreme cases if you are pregnant and the baby is going to kill you, you aren't allowed to abort it - get an illegal abortion - woops the app spied on me and now you are in prison.

I didn't really see laws as a threat to safety. While their enforcement can be, that train of thinking can be applied to anything. If you have a machine gun that isn't registered, is the app you took notes about it in a threat to your safety, or is it the law/enforcement? You can have people believe very strongly that abortion is a right or that owning an unregistered machine gun is a right. There may be implicit val…

> I didn't really see laws as a threat to safety.

I'm going to lay off of responding to you after this, I know I've made a couple of responses and quick succession, but these laws are a threat to safety in that they are preventing women from getting life-saving medical attention. Here is one example but there are many

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/investigation-links-georgi...

Re: Menstrual tracking app data is gold mine for advertisers that risks women safety

#259

Post by jedimastert »

zdragnar wrote: post #242
vinckr wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the most obvious is that abortions are illegal in the US and you can monitor that status through the app. So in extreme cases if you are pregnant and the baby is going to kill you, you aren't allowed to abort it - get an illegal abortion - woops the app spied on me and now you are in prison.

Elective abortions are illegal in some states. Even the most restrictive states, like those with six week bans, include exemptions for things like ectopic pregnancy and preeclampsia. Further, nationwide abortion rates are at an all-time high. The fall of Roe vs Wade has not moved the needle on that count.

More than just elective abortions, the ambiguity of the laws and serious threat to doctors are also preventing life-saving abortions

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/investigation-links-georgi...

Re: Menstrual tracking app data is gold mine for advertisers that risks women safety

#260

Post by freehorse »

em-bee wrote: post #217
josephg wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want this for my contact address book too. “This app would like to know all your contacts. Allow / send empty contact list / generate garbage data” I’d also enjoy if my advertising cookies were randomly reused by people all over the globe. And I’d like my phone number and email address to get associated with dozens of other identities.

there is an alternative contact app that doesn't share your data. you can then fill the default contact app with fake data or leave it empty. i am not sure if the last point is a good idea though. i get what you want to achieve. anonymity in numbers and plausible deniability, but you are more likely to get mixed up with problematic stuff others are doing rather than protecting yourself. having a common name already s…

> there is an alternative contact app that doesn't share your data. you can then fill the default contact app with fake data or leave it empty.

You may want to share your contacts with app X but not with app Y, though.

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