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'The tyranny of apps': those without smartphones are unfairly penalised

theguardian.com

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Re: 'The tyranny of apps': those without smartphones are unfairly penalised

#251

Post by atlintots »

ctrlp wrote: post #104
hilbert42 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Look at it this way: should the rest of us with smartphones pay for that bank office?" To answer that question with any degree of rigor one has to go back to the beginning and study the works of Bentham, Mill and others—and the many issues that surround utility and utilitarian principles. This involves such issues as the greatest good for the greatest number, greed overpowering well established moral norms and the f…

Utilitarian models of ethics are fraught with peril themselves. Not the own you think it is.

Go on, then. Elaborate.

Re: 'The tyranny of apps': those without smartphones are unfairly penalised

#252

Post by ksec »

And in the good old day. Apple will force its hands on these sort of issues. But 10 years after Apple Pay and the Claims to replace your wallet. They are still millions miles away from doing it.

In many ways Apple without Steve Jobs feels more Google and Microsoft but with better taste of software and hardware.

>"So the people who make the company more successful are the sales and marketing people, and they end up running the companies. And the ‘product people’ get run out of the decision-making forums. The companies forget how to make great products. The product sensibility and product genius that brought them to this monopolistic position gets rotted out by people running these companies who have no conception of a good product vs. a bad product. They have no conception of the craftsmanship that’s required to take a good idea and turn it into a good product.

>"And they really have no feeling in their hearts about wanting to help the costumers.” *

Re: 'The tyranny of apps': those without smartphones are unfairly penalised

#253

Post by svelle »

lambda wrote: post #156
pqtyw wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1. Parking apps are worse than parking meters. I certainly don't agree with that one. I really don't miss having to pay for a fixed number of hours and then having to figure out what to do if I'm running late (or wasting money if I get back early). > 4. Airline apps that are worse than just printing a boarding pass. Unless the app is exceptionally horrible you can just export it to Apple/Android wallet which is muc…

I'm kind of puzzled by your first point. In my experience, parking apps require you to pay in larger chunks of hours than paying with coins used to; many times I have to pay for a minimum of 2 hours of parking with the app when I could pay for just 10 or 15 minutes of parking with coins.

The parking app I use in Berlin, easy park, works in the sense that I pre-select a timeframe I think im going to park which then gives me an estimate for how much it'll cost and reserve that amount using my CC. When I end the parking before that timer ends, the actual time I've parked will be taken and only that amount is charged.

It used to be even better in the sense that you'd only start and then end parking without having to pre select a time. But I think too many people, me included, forgot to end the parking when taking off and paid way more than they actually parked for.

Re: 'The tyranny of apps': those without smartphones are unfairly penalised

#254

Post by nayuki »

joshdavham wrote: post #127

I’m fascinated by this phenomenon of apps proposing solutions that are far worse than the previous existing solutions. For example: 1. Parking apps are worse than parking meters. 2. Tinder is worse than IRL speed dating. 3. Duolingo is worse than language classes. 4. Airline apps that are worse than just printing a boarding pass. 5. Etc It really makes me frustrated as someone who builds software and generally thinks…

> Parking apps are worse than parking meters.

Case in point - Toronto Parking Authority (Green P)'s app forces you to keep a balance and refill in multiples of $20 CAD, whereas street parking meters can charge your credit card in any increment as necessary (e.g. $1.25).

Also, the app forces you to disclose your phone number as an account identifier; you have no option to sign up by email or username. https://mobilepay.greenp.com/faq/i-have-a-new-phone-number-w...

The culture of designing user-hostile apps is wild.

Re: 'The tyranny of apps': those without smartphones are unfairly penalised

#255

Post by Kwpolska »

ryandrake wrote: post #163
pqtyw wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1. Parking apps are worse than parking meters. I certainly don't agree with that one. I really don't miss having to pay for a fixed number of hours and then having to figure out what to do if I'm running late (or wasting money if I get back early). > 4. Airline apps that are worse than just printing a boarding pass. Unless the app is exceptionally horrible you can just export it to Apple/Android wallet which is muc…

Don’t people just print their boarding passes at home before they leave for the airport? Or worst case, use the kiosks at the airports which print passes? Very few of the passengers in line ahead of me are using their phones.

People still have printers at home?

Low-cost airlines charge a fee for printing boarding passes at the airport.

Re: 'The tyranny of apps': those without smartphones are unfairly penalised

#256

Post by j-bos »

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #130
Boogie_Man wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At what point does this constitute a hostile action against the user and what degree of retaliation is appropriate? Open question for everyone.

what retaliation are you imagining and against whom? who is even "the user" here?

I imagine legal retaliation as the perpetual loading could be framed as blocking access to medical care.

Re: 'The tyranny of apps': those without smartphones are unfairly penalised

#257

Post by lawgimenez »

aucisson_masque wrote: post #239
2shortplanks wrote: post #167

One thing this article doesn’t mention is how this all falls apart when you spend time in more than one country. My UK bank (Barclays) won’t let me install their app on my US iPhone (i.e. my phone that uses a US based iCloud account). Tesco won’t let me use their loyalty app. I can’t install an app that’ll let me order Starbucks or McDonalds in the UK (I only have access to the US versions of these apps). I can’t wat…

Is this the same on Android side ? I know that you can more easily sideload app there so it could be an issue only on iphone walled garden.

Android app can still geolocate the user so yeah, still the same issue.

Re: 'The tyranny of apps': those without smartphones are unfairly penalised

#258

Post by crazygringo »

ryandrake wrote: post #236
crazygringo wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I just don't want to have to worry about my device being available during boarding I don't think most people worry about that at all. Why wouldn't it be available? If you're heading to the airport from home, your battery is charged. And if your phone somehow breaks on the way, you print at a kiosk. It seems far more likely that I'd lose a random piece of paper on the way to the airport than lose my phone...

Maybe I'm weird, but when I go on a trip, I generally pack my smartphone, if I bring it at all. It would be a royal pain to go find it again when I get into line to board.

Yup, that's definitely weird.

Most people get pretty bored going to the airport, in line at the airport, waiting for boarding, waiting to take off, during the flight.

A smartphone loaded with books and magazine articles and podcasts seems pretty essential by this point for nearly everyone.

Not to mention loved ones who want to reach you by text or phone...

Re: 'The tyranny of apps': those without smartphones are unfairly penalised

#259

Post by lenkite »

crazygringo wrote: post #235
kxrm wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me it is less about being concerned about my device running out of batteries. It's more about some weird incompatibility between my device and the scanner. It's one less thing to worry about when I just want to get on the plane. My paper ticket isn't going to lock before I get to the gate, or not be bright enough. I won't have to "play" with my ticket to keep it active and proper for the scanner.

> It's more about some weird incompatibility between my device and the scanner. That's not a thing. They're literally just cameras looking for a QR code. And unlocking your phone and adjusting brightness is pretty effortless, I dunno. I already do those things lots of times a day.

Its not effortless...and god forbid if your drop your smartphone and get it cracked. This headache is simply avoided with plain old paper reliability.

Re: 'The tyranny of apps': those without smartphones are unfairly penalised

#260

Post by tdeck »

Kwpolska wrote: post #246
tdeck wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can do that with a boarding pass downloaded from the airline website or emailed to you by the airline. But some airlines like to hide this option in order to force you to download their app.

How can you remotely update a PDF file after someone downloaded it?

Why would you need to do that? The boarding pass has a QR code on it; the QR code links to your ticket. If you need to change your booking, they can email you a new one.
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