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When your last name is Null, nothing works

wsj.com

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Re: When your last name is Null, nothing works

#251

Post by kuschku »

progre wrote: post #226
jwr wrote: post #223

This is terrifying, because it implies that so many computer systems interpret user-supplied data as what should be out-of-band values. No computer system should ever interpret what is in the "last name" field, it should be a sequence of characters only. Every attempt at interpretation is an exploit waiting to happen.

In YAML (the gift that keeps on giving, see the False/Norway debacle) the last name of Null would have to be quoted, otherwise it would signify the null value.

That's why you write yaml with a json encoder :)

Re: When your last name is Null, nothing works

#252

Post by LoganDark »

notarealllama wrote: post #224
jwr wrote: post #223

This is terrifying, because it implies that so many computer systems interpret user-supplied data as what should be out-of-band values. No computer system should ever interpret what is in the "last name" field, it should be a sequence of characters only. Every attempt at interpretation is an exploit waiting to happen.

Typed data?! What's next, unit tests? Memory safety? Where will it stop?

I would put memory safety before unit tests if it were me.

Re: When your last name is Null, nothing works

#253

Post by lqet »

marcyb5st wrote: post #238

Definitely not as bad, but I had problems with my name (Marcello) as well because it contains the name of a musical instrument. So I can only imagine what they are going through. The latest was Swiss airlines website which was kind of shocking since it is a proper Italian name and one of the official languages of the confederation. Most annoying instance was with the ESTA online application many years ago (fixed last…

Could someone with insider-knowledge elaborate on that? Why on earth would you exclude names that contain names of musical instruments from anything? Is it common that fake names contain musical instruments?

Re: When your last name is Null, nothing works

#254

Post by hashmush »

kstrauser wrote: post #109
impossiblefork wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

or people whose middle name is their first name.

Hey, that's also relevant to me! I've checked my local laws, and where I live, your legal name is the one you consistently present yourself as. If you're Joe Frank Smith, and you go by Frank everywhere, that's your legal name . I've gotten so tired of having this argument. Inevitably some clerk will insist on calling me by my first name, "you know, your legal name ". No. My middle name is my legal name. It's what my…

Sweden has a sensible solution to this (im sure others do too). When you register a name you specify which part is the tilltalsnamn (lit. name of adress). In your case, the names would be disambiguated as Joe Frank Smith and Joe Frank Smith.

Not all systems use that piece of information, but most do.

Re: When your last name is Null, nothing works

#255

Post by ooklala »

mcv wrote: post #227
jwr wrote: post #223

This is terrifying, because it implies that so many computer systems interpret user-supplied data as what should be out-of-band values. No computer system should ever interpret what is in the "last name" field, it should be a sequence of characters only. Every attempt at interpretation is an exploit waiting to happen.

I believe the primary point where this goes wrong is in http. There, null and "null" are indistinguishable. Using json would help, but older forms don't.

My money is on janky CSV ETL…

Re: When your last name is Null, nothing works

#256

Post by sensanaty »

progre wrote: post #226
jwr wrote: post #223

This is terrifying, because it implies that so many computer systems interpret user-supplied data as what should be out-of-band values. No computer system should ever interpret what is in the "last name" field, it should be a sequence of characters only. Every attempt at interpretation is an exploit waiting to happen.

In YAML (the gift that keeps on giving, see the False/Norway debacle) the last name of Null would have to be quoted, otherwise it would signify the null value.

I will forever curse whoever thought YAML was a good idea and spread it everywhere.

Re: When your last name is Null, nothing works

#257

Post by Arisaka1 »

notarealllama wrote: post #224
jwr wrote: post #223

This is terrifying, because it implies that so many computer systems interpret user-supplied data as what should be out-of-band values. No computer system should ever interpret what is in the "last name" field, it should be a sequence of characters only. Every attempt at interpretation is an exploit waiting to happen.

Typed data?! What's next, unit tests? Memory safety? Where will it stop?

I especially love when non-technical managers boldly claim that the customer doesn't pay for best practices and clean code, as if it's some sort of costumer-focused bold declaration that is more in touch with reality than what every other developer thinks.

Re: When your last name is Null, nothing works

#258

Post by jadyoyster »

lqet wrote: post #253
marcyb5st wrote: post #238

Definitely not as bad, but I had problems with my name (Marcello) as well because it contains the name of a musical instrument. So I can only imagine what they are going through. The latest was Swiss airlines website which was kind of shocking since it is a proper Italian name and one of the official languages of the confederation. Most annoying instance was with the ESTA online application many years ago (fixed last…

Could someone with insider-knowledge elaborate on that? Why on earth would you exclude names that contain names of musical instruments from anything? Is it common that fake names contain musical instruments?

You can book a seat for an instrument. I've seen EXTRA, ITEM SEAT mentioned as name for one particular airline but maybe it can get more specific with others?

Re: When your last name is Null, nothing works

#259

Post by teddyh »

mike_hearn wrote: post #249

Ironically, this article is full of the sort of semantic confusions that cause the problem in the first place. The reporter clearly hasn't run the article past an actual programmer as she seems to think this outcome is a deliberate design choice rather than a bug: > Null was first programmed 60 years ago by a British computer scientist named Tony Hoare ... Hoare probably wasn’t thinking about people with the 4,910th…

> I really don't get why journalists so rarely do basic fact checking

It takes time and effort with no discernable upside. In fact, knowing the true facts would make it harder for journalists to bias the story in the way they want to without them feeling a bit bad for lying. It’s easier for them if they don’t know.

> that undermines their credibility without them even noticing.

Not really. Even the vanishingly small minority of readers who know the details of the story in question suffer from Gell-Mann amnesia, and continue to believe that all other stories (by the same paper, and even from the same reporter) are perfectly accurate.

Re: When your last name is Null, nothing works

#260

Post by null_name »

my legal last name has been "Null" for a bit over half a year, and I've had no problems. before changing it, I asked a friend whose legal last name had been "Null" for a couple years. it hadn't had any issues. this article (and the one about the British guy) is overblown.
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