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"Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

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Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#251

Post by exe34 »

curt15 wrote: post #165
dkobia wrote: post #128

This new administration lays bare what we've known all along - the legislative gridlock and dysfunction in the house of representatives and senate has made them completely incapable of governing -- the least productive in a generation. This is opened up an opportunity for a well funded strongman, and the checks and balances that were intended to protect our democracy are now mere suggestions.

>This new administration lays bare what we've known all along - the legislative gridlock and dysfunction in the house of representatives and senate has made them completely incapable of governing -- the least productive in a generation. Yet GOP senators were more than happy to claim credit for infrastructure funding that they opposed.

Trump also rubbished the trade deals that he himself signed!

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#252

Post by whamlastxmas »

teeray wrote: post #229
calibas wrote: post #217

If you're wondering why the President can essentially write his own laws when that's not how our system is supposed to work, it's because the President gets extra powers whenever we're in a state of national emergency. We've been in a state of national emergency since 1979.

States of emergency should at least go to congress for renewal every 3 months as a measure to be voted on individually (cannot be tied, for example, to budgets). If that's not enough to kill it eventually, it should automatically become a ballot measure on the next Presidential Ballot after some number of renewals.

There’s a lot of common sense “should” statements that are true and will never happen

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#253

Post by dgb23 »

intended wrote: post #160
zusammen wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the sad reality of oligarchy. Red/blue culture wars appeal to some people because they would prefer an authoritarianism that at least pretends to have their back 50 percent of the time over rich people (their employers) who have their back 0 percent of the time. No one wants (and I don’t think anyone should want) bipartisanship, not really. Bipartisanship means the rich get everything they want—efficiently. I…

Bipartisan efforts are what makes Congress work. It’s this loss that plagues Congress. Bipartisanship is what was jettisoned by the republicans to ensure that they would always be able to blame democrats for the failure of the government. Even during Obamacare, when they adopted a Republican plan, Romney had to distance himself from it. Despite all the efforts for Bipartisan outreach - for all the concessions, the re…

Looking at this mess from far away in Switzerland.

I'm so glad we have a consensus democracy. We're a small country but I don't see any reason why a more moderate, consensus based system couldn't be adopted by larger ones. In fact I think this centralization of power around one person doesn't scale.

I'm also glad that we have the direct vote in order to reign in our government whenever they overreach or turn too far away from our interests. That seems much harder to implement in larger countries, but it's an excellent tool to course correct a government.

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#254

Post by 1dom »

tmendez wrote: post #227
scarab92 wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

This is untrue

This is just as unhelpful than the comment you responded to. Without any context, or links or sources for either side, it's just adding uncertainty and doubt.

I'm an outside observer, and I want to to believe your side, but I can't any more than I can believe the comment you responded to. Regardless, nobody wants the discussion to descend into unsubstantiated "you're lying" ... "no _you're_ lying".

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#255

Post by KittenInABox »

grandempire wrote: post #206
KittenInABox wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno, it makes sense that the federal branch that manages interest rates is independent of the president. Didn't we have a whole thing where Trump couldn't force rate increases or decreases back in 2020? Do we really want Trump to declare interest rate changes via tweeting or whatever? What about things like drug approvals? I don't want Trump to ban certain drugs just because they didn't donate to his campaign. I…

It makes sense that we don’t elect a fed chairmen, but if the fed chairmen doesn’t report to any elected official then where do they get their authority? Supreme Court Judges are appointed by elected officials, but then don’t report to anyone. Maybe a fed chairmen is like that? But there is no constitutional office like that. Surely congress can’t make up offices which are then untouchable? I don’t want trump playing…

> It makes sense that we don’t elect a fed chairmen, but if the fed chairmen doesn’t report to any elected official then where do they get their authority?

Congress put in a process for a fed chairman to be appointed in a way that jointly incorporates president, house and senate. Similarly firing them also needs joint cooperation, then the people have some say by electing/unelecting a congress or president that fucks it up. Same for FDA, USPS, etc etc. I definitely want a formalized process to hire and fire these guys and not just up to whims of individual executives.

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#256

Post by JKCalhoun »

hayst4ck wrote: post #98
greyface- wrote: post #44

This is obviously alarming, and if used to disregard the Judiciary's interpretation of law, unconstitutional. But I'm puzzled by the exemption of the Federal Reserve and FOMC. He's previously beefed with them, and would presumably find the additional leverage useful. Why explicitly exclude them?

Inflation is an extreme handout to the wealthy. Money is by definition zero sum, otherwise the word "inflation" would have no meaning. There are good questions around what an over leveraged loan is, but fundamentally, the supply of money is to some degree fixed at any given moment. The wealthy and powerful keep their money in tax benefited, inflation tracking assets. Many of those assets are stocks, and a major busin…

> Money is by definition zero sum, otherwise the word "inflation" would have no meaning.

Not sure that I agree, nor that the one follows from the other.

Without having the advantage of an Economics degree, I have witnessed when rising tides have lifted all boats and a majority of U.S. society benefited. Perhaps "wealth" is not a zero sum.

And if that is case, talking about "money" is orthogonal. We should talk instead about disposable income, standard of living, etc.

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#257

Post by JKCalhoun »

1dom wrote: post #254
tmendez wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is untrue

This is just as unhelpful than the comment you responded to. Without any context, or links or sources for either side, it's just adding uncertainty and doubt. I'm an outside observer, and I want to to believe your side, but I can't any more than I can believe the comment you responded to. Regardless, nobody wants the discussion to descend into unsubstantiated "you're lying" ... "no _you're_ lying".

You're correct — but they were in fact responding to someone that also offered no sources.

You can engage in the Gish gallop if you like, but to the original comment: extraordinary claims require....

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#258

Post by Zamaamiro »

This EO, combined with his proclamation that "He who saves the country does not violate any law" paint a very concerning picture. This has, historically speaking, been the language of tyrants. No President is above the law, nor does the President "interpret" the law; that is the domain of the Judiciary.

“Wherever law ends, tyranny begins”

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#259

Post by cowfriend »

gottorf wrote: post #209
snowwrestler wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We’re not “missing” anything, your interpretation of the Constitution is incorrect. You may want to scroll up and read Article I, which constrains Article II (that’s why it comes first). Your understanding of Chevron deference is also incorrect, for what it’s worth.

> You may want to scroll up and read Article I, which constrains Article II (that’s why it comes first) What in Article I imposes constraints on the presidency? It's almost all about the legislature itself, and hardly mentions the executive. Specifically, I don't see anything that lends credence to the idea that Congress can control the workings of executive departments.

> I don't see anything that lends credence to the idea that Congress can control the workings of executive departments.

Along with what others have said, you might want to recognize that Congress controls the purse. They dictate how much the executive should spend on each item, though that can be nuanced (as in "up to this much" vs "exactly this much")

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#260

Post by marcosdumay »

vacuity wrote: post #248
marcosdumay wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can we drop the "tech" prefix from our neo-feudalism? Technology is necessarily a progressive force, and feudalism is necessarily a stagnatory conservative structure. The "Tech Supremacy" group is visibly opposed to technology, and it's reflecting more and more on society as they gain power.

> Technology is necessarily a progressive force Technology is a tool. It is not a culture or a system. In fact, I think state and corporate use of technology for things like surveillance, censorship, frankly pointless jobs that somehow attract VC money, mass propaganda and social media access, data tracking and advertising and behavior modelling to a T, hypothetical pointless-job-destroying-AGI, etc. that are current…

Conservative people just can't create technology. Technology is always progressive.

It can be progressive towards any amount of things, good or bad. But conservatism requires not developing it.

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