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Jaywalking legalized in New York City

theguardian.com

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Re: Jaywalking legalized in New York City

#251

Post by standardUser »

giantg2 wrote: post #165
standardUser wrote: post #108

First, let's not forget that jaywalking is one of those "crimes" that is used as a pretense by police to harass people, usually young people and people of color. Second, as a veteran jaywalker, my rule of thumb is that if a car has to hit their breaks even a little, or otherwise alter their trajectory, you're doing it wrong. The goal should be smooth movement for all. Third, just because someone else is jaywalking do…

"Second, as a veteran jaywalker, my rule of thumb is that if a car has to hit their breaks even a little, or otherwise alter their trajectory, you're doing it wrong." You're doing it illegally in most places. If you imped the flow of traffic with the right of way, that's still an offense in most places. The article isn't clear if it's still a violation in NYC, but I bet it is.

I brazenly break jaywalking laws every day and in every city I visit and will continue to do so.

Re: Jaywalking legalized in New York City

#252

Post by standardUser »

abeppu wrote: post #157
standardUser wrote: post #108

First, let's not forget that jaywalking is one of those "crimes" that is used as a pretense by police to harass people, usually young people and people of color. Second, as a veteran jaywalker, my rule of thumb is that if a car has to hit their breaks even a little, or otherwise alter their trajectory, you're doing it wrong. The goal should be smooth movement for all. Third, just because someone else is jaywalking do…

> First, let's not forget that jaywalking is one of those "crimes" that is used as a pretense by police to harass people, usually young people and people of color. But let's also not pretend that decriminalizing jaywalking ends this harassment. In 2023, California decriminalized jaywalking when it's not dangerous to cross. But police have still used jaywalking as a pretense for stopping (and assaulting) people. https…

I don't know why you're downvoted, I think you are totally correct, but these changes to the laws do make it less simple for cops.

Re: Jaywalking legalized in New York City

#253

Post by tmm84 »

mc32 wrote: post #164
standardUser wrote: post #108

First, let's not forget that jaywalking is one of those "crimes" that is used as a pretense by police to harass people, usually young people and people of color. Second, as a veteran jaywalker, my rule of thumb is that if a car has to hit their breaks even a little, or otherwise alter their trajectory, you're doing it wrong. The goal should be smooth movement for all. Third, just because someone else is jaywalking do…

Traveling in Germany where there is a culture of biking and walking I found that jaywalking is never the less very much frowned upon by regular people and they see it as a transgression of norms.

Having spent so many years in Japan I have found the same attitude about jaywalking. Though, there are crosswalks on long streets where pedestrians can wait and drivers are taught to stop at if someone is waiting to cross. I haven't seen much reason to jaywalk here in Japan.

Re: Jaywalking legalized in New York City

#254

Post by [deleted] »

NBJack wrote: post #219
bko wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> I love hearing about this magical world where police harass random people for no reason. Nothing random, magical, or pretend about it in the states. https://www.aclu.org/issues/racial-justice/race-and-criminal... Talk to folks that don't share your skin tone. Make some friends. Ask them about their experiences, then judge for yourself.

[deleted]

Re: Jaywalking legalized in New York City

#255

Post by mc3301 »

tmm84 wrote: post #253
mc32 wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Traveling in Germany where there is a culture of biking and walking I found that jaywalking is never the less very much frowned upon by regular people and they see it as a transgression of norms.

Having spent so many years in Japan I have found the same attitude about jaywalking. Though, there are crosswalks on long streets where pedestrians can wait and drivers are taught to stop at if someone is waiting to cross. I haven't seen much reason to jaywalk here in Japan.

It really depends on where you are in Japan (and each individual crosswalk). I've encountered plenty of places where jaywalking is necessary to save a long detour of a walk. Though those places are pretty clear of traffic. High traffic places where one might want to jaywalk? Pedestrian bridges are built there. So nice. I similarly find that at most crosswalk, most people stop for you. Also nice. The only not nice thing? At completely empty intersection on tiny little backroads, pedestrians STILL wait for the light to turn green. Thus making me look like some rebel if I boldly walk or bicycle across the absolutely empty intersection through a red light.

Re: Jaywalking legalized in New York City

#256

Post by fragmede »

ssl-3 wrote: post #180
fragmede wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless expressly prohibited , eg by said sign, right-turn-on-red defaults to being legal across vthe US.

Unless I'm missing something: Defining traffic laws is something that the states do on their own, and these aren't things that the federal government generally gets involved with. Thus, there are 50 different sets of these laws, plus DC. Any similarities between them may be nothing more than incidental.

Sorta.

> The Energy Policy and Conservation Act of 1975 required in §362(c)(5) that in order for a state to receive federal assistance in developing mandated conservation programs, they must permit right turns on red lights. All 50 states, the District of Columbia, Guam, and Puerto Rico have allowed right turns on red since 1980, except where prohibited by a sign or where right turns are controlled by dedicated traffic lights.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turn_on_red?#North_America

Re: Jaywalking legalized in New York City

#257

Post by mc3301 »

fooker wrote: post #203
elif wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea the herd mentality is why jaywalking is unethical. I've witnessed someone try to cross early, triggering literally ~20 people to follow, only for the light to change and everyone collectively realized they had no right of way and stepped back. It's easy to see how this could result in tragedy. Germany, Japan, there is strict social compliance so it feels right anyway.

> Germany, Japan, there is strict social compliance There is quite a bit of historical evidence for this being really bad for society.

How're those places of low compliance doing recently?

Re: Jaywalking legalized in New York City

#258

Post by sokoloff »

leecarraher wrote: post #175

is there a difference, legally, regarding vehicular involuntary manslaughter, between hitting someone who is jaywalking and someone who is not. Example, a person walks into a 65 mph thoroughfare after a curve, since they are no longer in the commencement of a crime, does that make the act tantamount to hitting someone in a crosswalk?

Pedestrians are barred (by law) from limited access highways in my state (and I think in most states). I can't readily think of any 65 mph highway that isn't limited access.

Re: Jaywalking legalized in New York City

#259

Post by almostgotcaught »

abeppu wrote: post #157
standardUser wrote: post #108

First, let's not forget that jaywalking is one of those "crimes" that is used as a pretense by police to harass people, usually young people and people of color. Second, as a veteran jaywalker, my rule of thumb is that if a car has to hit their breaks even a little, or otherwise alter their trajectory, you're doing it wrong. The goal should be smooth movement for all. Third, just because someone else is jaywalking do…

> First, let's not forget that jaywalking is one of those "crimes" that is used as a pretense by police to harass people, usually young people and people of color. But let's also not pretend that decriminalizing jaywalking ends this harassment. In 2023, California decriminalized jaywalking when it's not dangerous to cross. But police have still used jaywalking as a pretense for stopping (and assaulting) people. https…

> But let's also not pretend that decriminalizing jaywalking ends this harassment

Can you show me a single person that thinks/says this

Re: Jaywalking legalized in New York City

#260

Post by rascul »

bsimpson wrote: post #148
nobody9999 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>New Yorkers don't have a concept of "jaywalking"; it's just "walking." As a general rule, I watch the cars and not the traffic lights. Mostly because many motorists (and NYC buses are the worst!) often don't pay attention to pedestrians, intersections or traffic lights. In fact, I'm more careful when walking through an intersection than in the middle of the street.

New York is probably the only place in the US where most of the drivers did not learn to drive here. It's the most international city in the US, and a disproportionate number of people who use the roads (taxis, delivery drivers, etc) grew up in places that have a traffic system very different that the US's. People in New York routinely run red lights, roll through crosswalks, ride in the shoulder - things that you mi…

> New York is probably the only place in the US where most of the drivers did not learn to drive here.

Not the only place. Many in the Washington DC area learned to drive elsewhere in the country.

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