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NASA investigation finds Boeing hindering Americans' return to moon

flyingmag.com

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Re: NASA investigation finds Boeing hindering Americans' return to moon

#251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The USSR had just beat the US to put the first man into space. The same USSR that was killing political dissidents en masse and building an arsenal of terrifying nuclear weapons. John F. Kennedy set out the ambitious goal of putting a man on the moon before the end of the decade, and then he was assassinated. People wanted to make that happen. So they did. There hasn't been a lot to inspire people to work for the gov…

While this is how this story is regularly retold it's not quite accurate. Polling around the Moon program tells that while there was a large minority of people vehemently in support of it, the overall response was mixed, and NASA was generally seen as a good target to cut funding from. [1] I think there are lots of parallels between the Moon landings in the 60s and the idea of colonizing Mars today. In particular, mo…

According to your own link, the thing people don't like isn't space exploration, it's paying for it:

> "When you divorce it from the numbers and you ask people if they like NASA and spaceflight, people say yes," Launius told SPACE.com. "75 to 80 percent are in favor."

Because obviously; people don't like paying for anything.

If you ask someone without a lot of surplus in their life whether they'd rather have the money themselves in tax cuts or benefits or they want to spend it on astronauts, they want food on their table. Especially when they're overestimating how much the space program costs.

But the question was, did people want to work for NASA? And then you get to select your idealists from the >75% in favor of the space program.

Re: NASA investigation finds Boeing hindering Americans' return to moon

#252
post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who stack-ranks the management? How?

You would have employees evaluate the managers. You can have outside consultants also evaluate the health of the management --but that can get tricky.

Neither approach works.

Engineers (management are also employees, right?) ranking management erodes management authority, and management will never stand for it.

Outside consultants are usually hired with a fixed agenda - the rotten eggs almost always get to stay.

Stack ranking is evil, period.

Re: NASA investigation finds Boeing hindering Americans' return to moon

#253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The USSR had just beat the US to put the first man into space. The same USSR that was killing political dissidents en masse and building an arsenal of terrifying nuclear weapons. John F. Kennedy set out the ambitious goal of putting a man on the moon before the end of the decade, and then he was assassinated. People wanted to make that happen. So they did. There hasn't been a lot to inspire people to work for the gov…

> killing political dissidents That's a funny perspective. USSR just before that time mostly killed communist apparatus members¥ and with them innocent people. In such an environment, there naturally won't be too many dissidents, so I don't think they registered. They did kill a lot of supposed sympathiers of pre-Soviet Russia, though. ¥ As they say, internal competition is the most fierce one.

Are you forgetting that the USSR took control of about a dozen other countries during and after the war? That led to events like Katyn, which had nothing to do with communist dissidents.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre

Re: NASA investigation finds Boeing hindering Americans' return to moon

#254

> During a visit to Michoud in 2023, for example, inspectors discovered that welding on a component of the SLS Core Stage 3 did not meet NASA standards. Per the report, unsatisfactory welding performed on a set of fuel tanks led directly to a seven-month delay in EUS completion. > “According to NASA officials, the welding issues arose due to Boeing’s inexperienced technicians and inadequate work order planning and su…

Related: https://www.realcleardefense.com/articles/2024/08/12/whats_b...

The Navy’s ability to build lower-cost warships that can shoot down Houthi rebel missiles in the Red Sea depends in part on a 25-year-old laborer who previously made parts for garbage trucks.

Lucas Andreini, a welder at Fincantieri Marinette Marine, in Marinette, Wisconsin, is among thousands of young workers who’ve received employer-sponsored training nationwide as shipyards struggle to hire and retain employees.

The labor shortage is one of myriad challenges that have led to backlogs in ship production and maintenance at a time when the Navy faces expanding global threats. Combined with shifting defense priorities, last-minute design changes and cost overruns, it has put the U.S. behind China in the number of ships at its disposal — and the gap is widening.

Navy shipbuilding is currently in “a terrible state” — the worst in a quarter century, says Eric Labs, a longtime naval analyst at the Congressional Budget Office. “I feel alarmed,” he said. “I don’t see a fast, easy way to get out of this problem. It’s taken us a long time to get into it.”

Re: NASA investigation finds Boeing hindering Americans' return to moon

#255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Collins Aerospace is offering $19/hr for third shift welding work on aircraft. It was referred to me by someone in the labor community, and I spoke with HR under the guise of a prospective candidate to confirm. They do $26B/year in revenue.

excuse me but what is third shift welding? is this the security lvl of the welding job?thank you

Third shift is the overnight shift at a 24-hour workplace. Usually that means midnight to 8 AM.

Re: NASA investigation finds Boeing hindering Americans' return to moon

#256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While SpaceX has been successful and innovative, it certainly doesn’t keep folks around. Average tenure is ~3.6 years. Those folks are smart, and can always find work elsewhere. Are we optimizing for the individual? Or for an aerospace manufacturing and supply chain system that requires care and feeding over decades? A tale as old as time.

As a private company how are you even getting those numbers? I'm certain they vary dramatically by specialty within SpaceX.

I think LinkedIn exposes these stats on Company pages. Search company and click the Insights tab.

Edit: Median tenure is 2.8 yrs according to LinkedIn.

Re: NASA investigation finds Boeing hindering Americans' return to moon

#257
post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a private company how are you even getting those numbers? I'm certain they vary dramatically by specialty within SpaceX.

I think LinkedIn exposes these stats on Company pages. Search company and click the Insights tab. Edit: Median tenure is 2.8 yrs according to LinkedIn.

Average tenure will always be low in a growing company, not due to people leaving but due to people joining.

Can see here space X has more than doubled the number of people the past few years, that is enough to explain that "low tenure", its just due to people joining.

https://uploads-ssl.webflow.com/62ac4aacc75a115ff9dcb9bc/639...

Re: NASA investigation finds Boeing hindering Americans' return to moon

#258

> During a visit to Michoud in 2023, for example, inspectors discovered that welding on a component of the SLS Core Stage 3 did not meet NASA standards. Per the report, unsatisfactory welding performed on a set of fuel tanks led directly to a seven-month delay in EUS completion. > “According to NASA officials, the welding issues arose due to Boeing’s inexperienced technicians and inadequate work order planning and su…

Related: https://www.realcleardefense.com/articles/2024/08/12/whats_b... The Navy’s ability to build lower-cost warships that can shoot down Houthi rebel missiles in the Red Sea depends in part on a 25-year-old laborer who previously made parts for garbage trucks. Lucas Andreini, a welder at Fincantieri Marinette Marine, in Marinette, Wisconsin, is among thousands of young workers who’ve received employer-sponsored t…

Government incentivized wall-st backed outsourcing of critical skill sets turned out to be a bad idea.

Re: NASA investigation finds Boeing hindering Americans' return to moon

#259

> During a visit to Michoud in 2023, for example, inspectors discovered that welding on a component of the SLS Core Stage 3 did not meet NASA standards. Per the report, unsatisfactory welding performed on a set of fuel tanks led directly to a seven-month delay in EUS completion. > “According to NASA officials, the welding issues arose due to Boeing’s inexperienced technicians and inadequate work order planning and su…

Related: https://www.realcleardefense.com/articles/2024/08/12/whats_b... The Navy’s ability to build lower-cost warships that can shoot down Houthi rebel missiles in the Red Sea depends in part on a 25-year-old laborer who previously made parts for garbage trucks. Lucas Andreini, a welder at Fincantieri Marinette Marine, in Marinette, Wisconsin, is among thousands of young workers who’ve received employer-sponsored t…

I think it is a great development, the US decided to export jobs to other countries to pay less its own workers, so it fits well that now it has no expertise to build its war machines.

Re: NASA investigation finds Boeing hindering Americans' return to moon

#260
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"This service is awful, let's switch to the better one" You: "and give them money in exchange for services rendered?!!?"

The whole thing is a boondoggle and running a deficit to redistribute more wealth to the top should disgust people. Your strawman is meaningless.

Musk is only really rich because he owned Tesla and SpaceX and those were only successful because they produced better stuff and transformed their industries. The system is kind of working as intended. Do you think things would be better if Musk never happened and we had relied on GM and Boeing?
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