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Multiple Displays on a Mac Sucks

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Re: Multiple Displays on a Mac Sucks

#251

Post by rcarmo »

I have a hard time accepting some of the points in this article.

I have a 5K, 34" ultra-wide LG (https://taoofmac.com/space/blog/2021/08/21/1600) and a somewhat-4K-like tall 28" LG (https://taoofmac.com/space/blog/2023/05/31/0845) in front of me most of the day, alternating with a 15" Surface HIDPI plus a 14" 4K external monitor for calls on my standing desk.

On the Mac, apps open on the same displays and locations most of the time. Granted that Stage Manager is a cluster...flow of confusion, but I actually appreciate the way I can get sets of windows "back" in the same positions when I switch tasks.

Full screen games work the same way on both platforms (three if you count my Ideapad Flex, which runs Fedora and is occasionally plugged into one of those monitors)

Side docks are... well, an affectation, really, but let's call it _deeply ingrained personal choice_. As a former NeXT user and long-term WindowMaker refugee, I liked them until I realised that hiding the dock and having it back on-demand did wonders for my sanity (esp. regarding notifications). So now the docks stay off-screen, at the bottom (like GNOME).

The menu bar... Is the last bastion of nice, usable UX in a world of Electron. So I like having it everywhere (although it is always dimmed in inactive displays screen), because Fitts' Law ensures I have something I can hit with my mouse in a hurry.

Having windows on the "wrong" display is... highly dependent on the type of window and where your focus is, but largely consistent (system alerts always show up in the right display, etc.)

The ergonomics of multiple displays are a highly personal thing, but in my "left-tall, centre-wide" setup (where bezels are all The right-hand side of my desk is where I keep the "distracting" stuff like my phone, mug, pencils, electronics parts, etc., and that's comfortable for me. But it's not a Mac-specific issue.

So yeah, there are a lot of first-world considerations in this piece, but I wouldn't consider it representative of any real issues.

Re: Multiple Displays on a Mac Sucks

#252

Post by rcarmo »

stevage wrote: post #158
brtkdotse wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Three times I tried switching from Windows to Mac and each time I bounced because of how janky basic window ergonomics were. I shouldn't have to buy single-dollar-programs to fix core OS functionality.

Huh. After years of mar I tried to go back to windows. I did it for 2 years but I'm so much happier on Mac again. I did kind of like the windows thg of dragging a window to the top to maximise, but that stuff is easy to replace with an app or two. General OS slowness and instability and clunky design not so much.

If you miss some specific Windows behaviour, I might have listed an app that implements it: https://taoofmac.com/space/apps/window_managers

(I switch between Windows and Mac throughout the day, so window tiling and Fancy Zones were things I missed)

Re: Multiple Displays on a Mac Sucks

#253

Post by hysan »

Not remembering window placement is why I’ve been exploring switching back to Linux. But on Linux, I’m kinda shocked at the lack of per-monitor workspaces / virtual desktops and the lack of good gestures. I feel like for my workflow, workspace management > window placement because that forgetting only happens once per day. Any Linux DE suggestions that have the same type of multi-monitor workspace support and good gestures?

Re: Multiple Displays on a Mac Sucks

#254

Post by NBJack »

Rinzler89 wrote: post #224
hu3 wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

About FW and AV scans, doesn't macOS phone home when you execute programs? I remember some problem with programs hanging and/or slow to start because the phoning home functionality was having issues. edit: yep, it does https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/391379/does-macos-...

It does phone home yes, but people pretend it doesn't and only Windows is evil when it does so. At least it doesn't have ads.

Not yet. But rest assured, they are just getting started. I know of one theory that suggests ATT was really just Apple preparing to launch its own Ads network.

https://www.wired.com/story/apple-is-an-ad-company-now/

Re: Multiple Displays on a Mac Sucks

#255

Post by rcarmo »

baq wrote: post #210
whynotminot wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you ever consider there might be something wrong with your machine or some piece of software you’ve installed? Or do you think the rest of the world that has heaped praise on the Apple Silicon Macs has missed something you’ve seen?

I blame this on trying to use non-Apple hardware with the MacBook. I'm sure if I had an Apple Display instead of a g-sync 165Hz-capable monitor and closed the lid when hooked up everything would be... perhaps not fine, but good enough. The macbook is amazing when considered in isolation. Trying to use it in a workstation setting is definitely 'holding it wrong', which drives me nuts. Wasted potential and definitely u…

I have zero Apple displays out of the three or four I have in the office. They all work amazingly well -- often better than on Windows or Linux.

Re: Multiple Displays on a Mac Sucks

#256

Post by rcarmo »

joshstrange wrote: post #86

Interesting, I don’t have any of these issue due to 2 pieces of software: displayplacer [0] and Phoenix [1]. Both free and open source. displayplacer is a CLI tool that once you have your monitors configured how you want them, it can give you a command you can run in the future to reconfigure your monitors the same way again. I have 2 commands stored (that I activate via Alfred but I could have also set up aliases in…

Phoenix is _amazing_. I used it for a good while until I realised I didn't need all the features, but it is still prominent in my https://taoofmac.com/space/apps/window_managers page.

Re: Multiple Displays on a Mac Sucks

#257

Post by bombcar »

baq wrote: post #191
monsieurbanana wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> General OS slowness and instability and clunky design not so much. I can't tell whether you're talking about Windows or Mac here

My WindowServer is sitting at 30% CPU and 15% GPU on an M1 MacBook Pro and I have no idea why. I reboot the Mac more often than I rebooted my dogshit HP enterprise laptop. MacOS is just a bad OS. It's good if you only ever use the MacBook as a laptop, but the moment you hook it up to a useful setup, it becomes a drag.

Are you using an actual USB-C to DisplayPort adapter or a software-enabled adapter? If you're driving more than one monitor, it might be the software-enabled type, which is NOT actually multiple monitors over DisplayPort but some other weirdness.

Re: Multiple Displays on a Mac Sucks

#258

Post by sixothree »

alkonaut wrote: post #82

I work with desktop software and have to work with multiple display scenarios. It's on Windows, but I guess the problems are similar. Fundamentally, one issue is that the concepts of multiple screens, multiple desktops, multiple DPI's are usually quite young. Also, there is (at least in Windows) no well defined concept of "desktop configurations". There is no built in support for remembering which screen a particular…

I wrote an quick little app some 12 years ago. It remembers screen location for various windows. I added a sanity check for windows appearing completely off-screen. Apparently Windows uses negative coordinates for screens to the left of the main screen. So one limitation of the app is that it won't remember window positions when they are on the screen to the left. I should get around to fixing that eventually.

Re: Multiple Displays on a Mac Sucks

#259

Post by goosedragons »

j45 wrote: post #182
AceJohnny2 wrote: post #29

> The Mac operating system still Just. Fucking. Sucks. at remembering where windows were, when relaunching apps. I agree and it's confounding. For me it's even worse: when plugging back into my home office after some work on the road, it doesn't remember the window positions associated with that setup, and I have to reorganize my dozens of windows away from the laptop screen again. I've solved this through a 3rd-part…

I would disagree about Apple having a "rich docking ecosystem". Apple might be the only major manufacturer to not provide their own docking solution that work extremely well, beyond trying to do it with a display. As soon as the "pro" moniker is used, 2, if not 3 monitors are completely normal. Extra wide monitors do not cut it. 3 24" 2k monitors at 2560x1440 can be far preferable to a single ultrawie that barely pro…

It's also pretty bad if you have a personal computer and a work computer. It's mystifying that they sell $1000+ monitors with a single input. Like a terrible no name $100 POS these days will typically have two, if not 3 inputs.

Re: Multiple Displays on a Mac Sucks

#260

Post by sixothree »

resource_waste wrote: post #214
Toutouxc wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you can get better EVERYTHING outside their hardware I'm pretty sure my M1 MacBook Air was the most powerful fanless laptop on the market when I bought it, and there were just a few laptops with comparable battery life. I'm also pretty sure it had a GPU. (still has one)

>M1 MacBook Air was the most powerful fanless laptop Huh, my gaming laptop was the most powerful laptop with 3 USB-C ports and was the color blue. It also has an NVIDIA gpu. Apple had 0 blue laptops with 3 USB-C ports or NVIDIA GPUS. >I'm also pretty sure it had a GPU. (still has one) OH man! Victim of Apple marketing right here. You have an integrated GPU in your CPU. This is industry standard for the last 25+ years…

College students often prioritize battery life because they are away from chargers for so many hours of the day. And you absolutely have to admit the M1 Macs really just destroy Windows and Linux in terms of battery life.

Regardless, there are very practical reasons to have different priorities than yours.

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