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Proposal on implementing permanent time zones in the European Union

timeuse.barcelona

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Re: Proposal on implementing permanent time zones in the European Union

#251

Post by globular-toast »

Tagbert wrote: post #248
globular-toast wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You still have to know a bit about your buddy, though. You can probably assume he'll be awake at his midday, but what about 7:00? Is he an early riser? Or does he have other commitments at that time? In reality you'll just learn you can call around 16:00 your time. At that point it's just a number and doesn't matter what it is. If things really were more complicated and you always needed to ask the question of "when…

Those schedules are just timezones in disguise

Sort of, but not really. I know what time is convenient to call my parents and they live in the same time zone as me. I don't work it out every time based on what the "normal" schedule is. And that's not to mention who actually calls people randomly over text now anyway?

Re: Proposal on implementing permanent time zones in the European Union

#252

Post by dudul »

ghaff wrote: post #242
dudul wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US would definitely be more efficient with fewer timezones. Really we should find a way to remove at least one between the 2 coasts. United, no, but the US is not the EU. America is united by default, Europe divided.

The number of timezones is pretty irrelevant. It's that there is a 3 hour time difference between the East Coast and the West Coast. (And an 8-9 hour time difference between the West Coast and Europe.) But the only real way to deal with that is to shift Pacific Time to Mountain Time.

I can't see how my message wasn't clear enough. This is exactly what I meant. Did you think I was suggesting to remove a timezone without adjusting the remaining ones to reduce the time difference between the coasts?

Re: Proposal on implementing permanent time zones in the European Union

#253

Post by jonathankoren »

disgruntledphd2 wrote: post #227
jonathankoren wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Such European parochialism! Next you’ll be talking about how traveling more than 900 meters is an epic adventure. Trust me. You can deal with 3 hour time difference without even noticing.

Look, a couple of hundred thousand people commute across the border on the island of Ireland and there's huge cultural issues around basically everything. The Republic of Ireland would never be in a different timezone to the UK as long as part of the UK is on the island of Ireland. It's just not going to happen.

That may be, but don’t call a neighboring time zone “friction”.

I grew up next to Indiana, a state notorious for screwing up their time. (Scroll down to “History” and each decade for past 70 years.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_in_Indiana

Re: Proposal on implementing permanent time zones in the European Union

#254

Post by [deleted] »

gbil wrote: post #246
highmastdon wrote: post #32

We (Europe) shouldn't fragment time zones that much. We (NL) should stay on permanent summer time. Reasons - criminality is lower when there's longer light - earlier darkness leads to more accidents. It's better to have longer darkness after the masses are RESTED (in the morning), opposed to when they're TIRED (in the evening) - longer day-time for office workers, is more productive - shorter time of year that has lo…

Permanent summer time is fine for me too in Greece. The linked proposal of moving Greece to CET is a joke anyhow since even now in December in central Greece you have already twilight at 7am which is fine and more useful than having it at 6am and in the Summer without DST sunrise would be too early for any real use while the weather and culture (don’t forget that) makes more use of the sun light in the evening

[deleted]

Re: Proposal on implementing permanent time zones in the European Union

#255

Post by petre »

pharmakom wrote: post #229
highmastdon wrote: post #32

We (Europe) shouldn't fragment time zones that much. We (NL) should stay on permanent summer time. Reasons - criminality is lower when there's longer light - earlier darkness leads to more accidents. It's better to have longer darkness after the masses are RESTED (in the morning), opposed to when they're TIRED (in the evening) - longer day-time for office workers, is more productive - shorter time of year that has lo…

Counter argument: we need blue light from the morning sun to wake up properly.

Mobile phones, computer screens and LED lighting solved this problem.

Re: Proposal on implementing permanent time zones in the European Union

#256

Post by [deleted] »

euroderf wrote: post #210
serpix wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you're lucky, it is 3:30pm in Finland. Dusk at 3pm. Up north it is even worse, although they've got the Borealis and usually snow.

One element in timezone decisions is that kids should make the trip to school in daylight. But that is futile in Finland. Today's sunrise in Helsinki (very south) is nearly 9 o'clock.

[deleted]

Re: Proposal on implementing permanent time zones in the European Union

#257

Post by Freak_NL »

amai wrote: post #247
Freak_NL wrote: post #40

That line putting the whole Benelux, France, and Spain on one side of the divide (Western European Time) and Germany, Switzerland, and Italy on the other (Central European Time) makes this proposal just about dead in the water.

Central European Time in Benelux, France and Spain is basically Hitler time, see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38478402 If people would become aware of that the proposal might have more chances.

It's not a secret or anything. People won't care that the German occupation had anything to do with it, because before that Amsterdam Time ran 19 minutes and 32.13 seconds ahead of Greenwich! No one wants to go back to a timezone like that in the twenty first century.

Hitler actually did us a favour on that front.

Re: Proposal on implementing permanent time zones in the European Union

#258

Post by petre »

seydor wrote: post #118
qwytw wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And make converting time between different time zones/countries even more confusing.

But more work for programmers

As if DST isn't enough work - it messes up the linearity of time.

Re: Proposal on implementing permanent time zones in the European Union

#259

Post by jalk »

dirtybirdnj wrote: post #239
jalk wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? Perhaps you should checkout https://www.timeanddate.com/ to see when the sun rises/sets in the summer in various places. I.e. June 21st Stockholm - 03:30 and 22:08 with DST. The vast majority of people simply prefer evening sun to "useless" night sun.

So we should re-adjust timezones in places where it's not a problem because some different people have chosen to settle in places where the sun isn't as optimal... and their comfort outweighs the experience of the people who don't need timezone adjustment? Because they made a bad choice on where to live and now they don't care about the unintended consequence on others? Help me understand why "your" problem on the ot…

I simply gave you an example of why lots of people like DST, as a counter to your "hivemind" claim. Perhaps my example was too extreme, so consider southern Europe - June sunrise at around 04:30 and sunset at 19:50 without DST. I bet plenty of Italians rather have the sun set at 20:50 since very few get up before 05:30 anyway.

It seems that you also made a bad choice of where to live, since apparently it's a place on the other side of the earth where Europe has the power to imposed DST.

I do feel sorry for you, that you are so sensitive to these timezone changes, especially since it limits your holiday travels to mostly going north/south. Do be careful if venturing too far in either of those direction, as the sudden change in hours of daylight might also affect you negatively.

Re: Proposal on implementing permanent time zones in the European Union

#260

Post by janice1999 »

amai wrote: post #249
janice1999 wrote: post #67

This is absurd and absolutely detached from reality. Not one person on the island of Ireland is going to accept either a timezone border between Ireland and Northern Ireland or between Northern Ireland and Britain. Unsurprisingly not one expert or group on their list is Irish or from the UK.

No one is going to change the time just in the summer. That doesn’t make sense. It generates a additional time zone border between countries just in the summer. Just imagine the chaos this is causing with train schedules. Just imagine the problems this is causing for programming libraries handling time. And yet many countries do this every year.

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