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Facebook tracking is illegal in Europe

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Re: Facebook tracking is illegal in Europe

#251

Post by ternaus »

I do not know how to react about this. On one side I prefer my private information staying private.

On the other I use free services like Google, YouTube, Facebook all the time.

They make money selling our data, on the other, the fact that it is free for everyone is the democratization of the access to information. I suspect that even a subscription of $1 / month will push away more than half of the users for these services.

I prefer to live in the world where people have free access to search engines and large social networks.

Re: Facebook tracking is illegal in Europe

#252

Post by soperj »

coder543 wrote: post #191
soperj wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you call them Apple Retina displays when they were made by LG?

That is a pointless question. Why do you call them Apple iPhones when they’re made by Foxconn? Apple has not made displays in decades, if ever. They still contract the design to meet their specifications, and then market and sell those displays that they were involved with. That makes them Apple displays for marketing purposes. These days, Apple sources displays from multiple manufacturers, but they end up being near…

It's not when you're talking about a technological lead. They didn't even make these displays or come up with the technology for them, they just paid for the exclusive right for them for a certain period of time.

Re: Facebook tracking is illegal in Europe

#253

Post by Hnrobert42 »

dangrossman wrote: post #159
Hnrobert42 wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

It sounds fairly accurate to me. This is what killed the US-EU Privacy Shield program, twice. That was the government's attempt at creating a way for US companies like Facebook to legally process data of EU citizens under GDPR. It's been struck down by the EU courts, due to our federal government's spy powers and the CLOUD Act, that invalidate any claims US companies make about protecting personal data in their posse…

I was referring to comparing the US intel operation to the Stasi.

Re: Facebook tracking is illegal in Europe

#254

Post by Hnrobert42 »

fncivivue7 wrote: post #165
Hnrobert42 wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Hyperbole requires intent and exaggeration, can you point out either? I'm not seeing it. It's also 100% on topic. You not liking the discussion doesn't change that.

You believe the US intel operation is comparable to the Stasi?

Re: Facebook tracking is illegal in Europe

#256

Post by coder543 »

soperj wrote: post #252
coder543 wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is a pointless question. Why do you call them Apple iPhones when they’re made by Foxconn? Apple has not made displays in decades, if ever. They still contract the design to meet their specifications, and then market and sell those displays that they were involved with. That makes them Apple displays for marketing purposes. These days, Apple sources displays from multiple manufacturers, but they end up being near…

It's not when you're talking about a technological lead. They didn't even make these displays or come up with the technology for them, they just paid for the exclusive right for them for a certain period of time.

It’s a distinction without difference as far as the market is concerned. Your question was just flamebait. If other manufacturers saw how important this would be, and if Apple had zero involvement with the display development as you claim, then those other manufacturers should have bought exclusivity first.

Instead, I’m sure Apple was involved in the design and development. It’s not a coincidence that the display just happened to exactly quadruple the resolution of the iPhone’s previous display while maintaining the exact same size.

Either way, nothing useful can come from this topic diversion.

Re: Facebook tracking is illegal in Europe

#257

Post by helpfulclippy »

Hnrobert42 wrote: post #254
fncivivue7 wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hyperbole requires intent and exaggeration, can you point out either? I'm not seeing it. It's also 100% on topic. You not liking the discussion doesn't change that.

You believe the US intel operation is comparable to the Stasi?

The Stasi would be very proud of themselves if they constructed something on the scale of what the USIC has managed. I’m honestly a little surprised anyone would quibble with that point.

Re: Facebook tracking is illegal in Europe

#258

Post by QuarterReptile »

denton-scratch wrote: post #240

How valuable is "personalized ads"? I can see that there's not much point in serving me ads for e.g. women's clothing, because I'm not a woman. But even if you knew everything I read online, I think you'd be hard-pressed to guess what I want to buy. So I don't believe that advertisers need to know all about me. They just need a few data points: am I a man or a woman, do I ever buy anything (do I have any money), and…

On the other hand, outside of Proctor&Gamble-esque juggernauts of all things cheap and disposable in the grocery store, there's tons of stuff that appeals to small groups; this is a lot of what the internet and globalization has provided.

For example, my total spending on video games in the last 5 years is between 0 and $100, so game publishers should probably save their ad spend (and not annoy me with noise). My TV is seldom out of the closet and plugged in, and I spend maybe $1-200/month on books. I'm pretty interested in buying a tennis stringing machine and more sheet music to play, but it's too much effort for me to seek those things out, so I don't. These are just a few of an infinite array of identifiers that could provide worthwhile targeted ads to me.

As another example, most charities have a group of people who would be happy to give them money if they knew about the organizations, while most of the population is indifferent or, in some cases, opposed to their work.

I don't like advertising much, either, and it doesn't reach me that often, but it's ridiculous to suggest that personalized ads have no value.

Re: Facebook tracking is illegal in Europe

#259

Post by Macha »

Kalium wrote: post #244
bryanrasmussen wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Then, some random guy says he doesn't think Facebook's interpretation is right, a court agrees, and all of those billions of dollars have gone to waste. so when you say a crazy way of making laws, you mean the way that laws basically get made? >No regulator has had the idea of just going to Facebook, pretty sure there was all sorts of conversations with Facebook and others over at least 5 years where it was quite cl…

> so when you say a crazy way of making laws, you mean the way that laws basically get made? I think what's being characterized as crazy is that the laws as written are at best vague. It takes years to find out what they actually mean in implementable detail. This makes it very difficult to comply. Have you read through GDPR? I have. It talks a lot about "reasonable measures" and includes vast swaths of other laws wh…

Reasonable is a common term in laws, see for example the "reasonable person test" which is widespread in US civil law. Laws are not written like electrical codes in the most part because such specific laws either explicitly enumerate what is permissible (which is more ok for something like "acceptable methods of wiring a house" than "acceptable uses of data") or are rendered obsolete by the first thing the law writers didn't foresee ("Oh, the law bans tracking with cookies? Well we just have a server side database for UA+IP address combinations, so we don't need to comply" - in fact the first EU attempt at privacy law arguably failed for this reason)

Re: Facebook tracking is illegal in Europe

#260

Post by wpietri »

babypuncher wrote: post #221
wpietri wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple certainly deserves credit for mainstreaming some things, but they get a lot of undue credit for originating them. I have seen so many people saying that Apple or Steve Jobs invented the smartphone. :rolling_eyes:

I would argue that they invented the modern form factor of a smartphone, and a lot of the software design principles that go along with it. If you handed a kid an iPhone 2G plus a bunch of BlackBerries and Palm Treos from 2007 and asked them to classify the devices, I bet they would only call one of them a "smartphone".

If by "the modern form factor" you mean the slab of glass with a virtual keyboard, sure. Good for them. (Actually, I didn't look; maybe somebody else did that first. But I'll assume you checked.) They also did a bunch of the "crossing the chasm" work, and they marketed the hell out of it.

But that is distinct from inventing the smartphone. Apple generally doesn't invent things; they let other people invent and pioneer the space, and then they come in with a consumer-focused design and marketing operation to produce luxury products and capture the high end of consumer revenue.

Good for them, and they've been richly rewarded for it. But let's not pretend that we should think like 7 year olds just so we can avoid being accurate about who invented what.

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