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Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

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Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#251
post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DeFi really is just a series of distributed (not necessarily decentralised) applications that enable parties to enter into agreements involving virtual tokens without the need for a contractual agreement between them. Not relying on contractual agreements places enormous constraints on what DeFi can do. For example, DeFi can't handle counterparty risk at all. Therefore DeFi doesn't remove the need for conventional fi…

DeFi never claims to provide the exact same fiat and off-chain services as CeFi and CEX. It has specific goals, like replacing custody with non-custody, or replacing a centralized exchange with an automated market maker that no single party can control. This has different risks and trade-offs, obviously, but users who opted for Uniswap instead of FTX as their crypto exchange are probably pretty happy with their decis…

This is like telling someone who got a terrible haircut that they should have shaved their head instead. If they got a haircut it's because they wanted a haircut not a shaved head.

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#252
post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DeFi never claims to provide the exact same fiat and off-chain services as CeFi and CEX. It has specific goals, like replacing custody with non-custody, or replacing a centralized exchange with an automated market maker that no single party can control. This has different risks and trade-offs, obviously, but users who opted for Uniswap instead of FTX as their crypto exchange are probably pretty happy with their decis…

This is like telling someone who got a terrible haircut that they should have shaved their head instead. If they got a haircut it's because they wanted a haircut not a shaved head.

Your analogy makes no sense.

There are many users who just want to hold crypto and perform basic lending and exchanges, and would be willing to spend fractionally more in gas fees to achieve this with higher security guarantees.

Everybody at Barber CEX got a surprise head shaving the other week, meanwhile Barber DEX is still cutting people's hair normally even though it is more expensive and harder to find.

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#253
post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is like telling someone who got a terrible haircut that they should have shaved their head instead. If they got a haircut it's because they wanted a haircut not a shaved head.

Your analogy makes no sense. There are many users who just want to hold crypto and perform basic lending and exchanges, and would be willing to spend fractionally more in gas fees to achieve this with higher security guarantees. Everybody at Barber CEX got a surprise head shaving the other week, meanwhile Barber DEX is still cutting people's hair normally even though it is more expensive and harder to find.

What? No, you don't get it. You're making the same exact flawed point that you made before. DEXs are no substitute for CEXs.

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#254
post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

wallets are a crtptocurrency concept. you can do the same thing with a client certificate, boom, you are who the cert says you are.

> wallets are a cryptocurrency concept yes, agreed. But they do a lot more than let you speculate on cryptocurrencies. Right now I'm working on wallet for people who have zero interest in speculating on cryptocurrencies. > you can do the same thing with a client certificate yes agreed. You can think of web3 as a better PKI. I do.

> yes agreed. You can think of web3 as a better PKI. I do.

interesting point.

from a UI perspective, it's kinda true.

could have been their killer app, if the whole ecosystem thought about it, but in the end it's been just a byproduct of something that proved zero usefulness and even the "better PKI" argument it's been somewhat replicated by letsencrypt for HTTPS and it will for everything else when a sufficient number of users will show interest for it.

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do you think by 2030, all global governments and their citizens will voluntarily give away control over what they can consume and create to Google and Apple? It'll be Baidu and Tencent, but yes. This is already happening, and the internet is becoming more centralized, not less. Global traffic is balkanized, but it's split up among regional centralized controlling interesting, not no controlling interests. > Betting…

Balkanized is an interesting choice of word. It even has a Google definition, to divide countries and make them enemies of each other. Yet another victim of US imperialism. I weep for what was once a free and friendly nation. The kids nowadays are taught to hate their neighbors instead of learning how their parents or grandparents were part of a resistance that fought faschist Germany. That's just an aside. Nothing t…

> Yet another victim of US imperialism.

The collapse of the Ottoman Empire and Austro-Hungarian Empire into small nations in the Balkan Peninsula from 1817 to WWI was caused by US imperialism?

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#256
post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your analogy makes no sense. There are many users who just want to hold crypto and perform basic lending and exchanges, and would be willing to spend fractionally more in gas fees to achieve this with higher security guarantees. Everybody at Barber CEX got a surprise head shaving the other week, meanwhile Barber DEX is still cutting people's hair normally even though it is more expensive and harder to find.

What? No, you don't get it. You're making the same exact flawed point that you made before. DEXs are no substitute for CEXs.

For some users and use cases, they are.

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the us the credit card option has very strong statutory consumer protections. As a rule people should be using credit cards, not debit cards. I am fascinated by the ridiculous claims that this somehow makes things hard.

> In the us the credit card option has very strong statutory consumer protections. As a rule people should be using credit cards, not debit cards. ... and pay a lot of interest to their banks as a result. Here in Europe, we don't need to pay interest for credit cards or worry about paying CC bills on time to avoid them, as we have strong consumer protection laws in general and SEPA direct debits can be clawed back no…

That’s not how it works. If you pay it off in the month you pay $0. Maybe don’t be so confident.

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#258
post #168
post #127

Web3 refers to the emerging shift in internet value chains from permissioned, centralized databases to permissionless, decentralized databases where users own their data. The driving force behind Web3 is that we can now enforce invariants on state transitions in a permissionless, decentralized manner for a limited set of applications (mostly financial). For an even more limited set of applications, we can also enforc…

I think what gets me is that nobody ends up actually doing this. The biggest and most productive entities on web3 that have the most users are the ones that everyone has heard of: crypto exchanges, or in other words, permissioned, centralized databases. Everything else seems to be a sideshow as far as actual usage is concerned. How do proponents of web3 square this?

I'm not aware of a centralized exchanges "on web3". Can you point to? Companies like Coinbase, Kraken, Binance are not "on web3", if that's what you mean.

There are few crypto exchanges that are "on web3", like Uniswap, Curve, Balancer, etc. And they don't rely on a centralized database.

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#260
post #127

Web3 refers to the emerging shift in internet value chains from permissioned, centralized databases to permissionless, decentralized databases where users own their data. The driving force behind Web3 is that we can now enforce invariants on state transitions in a permissionless, decentralized manner for a limited set of applications (mostly financial). For an even more limited set of applications, we can also enforc…

This is a great summary. Many of the critiques I've read here criticize the early users of the technology, which is like blaming cars when the blame should be on bad drivers.

The main problem with it is that "web3" is a technological answer to what is not a technological problem. Aside from IP assignments, the internet is inherently decentralized as it is. It's just that people don't choose to use it that way.
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