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NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

iapps.courts.state.ny.us

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Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#251

Post by spaetzleesser »

triceratops wrote: post #203
spaetzleesser wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same happened in CA with some stores being open and others closed. Why was Home Depot open? It made no sense in terms of spreading the disease . It was just arbitrary BS. Closing the beaches was stupid too. If there ever was a safe place then it was the beach or state park wheee uou are in the open and the window blows.

Home Depot was open because people need to fix shit around their house if you want them to stay home. What's arbitrary about that? I agree with you about the beaches. But in the early days, we didn't really know what worked and what didn't. People said 6 feet apart was safe enough indoors because "droplets containing the virus fall to the ground".

A small hardware store in town went out of business because they were forced to close. Same for a lot of other small stores. I could understand reducing number of people in the store but closing totally while keeping others open simply didn’t make sense. I think the exceptions had more to do with successful lobbying than with health reasons.

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#252

Post by ghoward »

xyzzy_plugh wrote: post #230
tlogan wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is important to understand that not all people who against vax mandates are anti-vaxers.

I thought about this for several moments, and I disagree. Vaccines offer some personal protection but predominantly become effective by achieving herd immunity. Vaccine hesitancy undermines this goal and weakens the system. Being pro-vaccine is senseless without being in favor of enough people being vaccinated to provide strong immunity, including for those who cannot be vaccinated due to medical complications. Even…

This argument is useless in the face of the COVID shots because they do not prevent transmission, an important factor in herd immunity being effective.

Being anti-vax-mandate for an ineffective vaccine is not anti-vax in any way.

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#253

Post by ms4720 »

xyzzy_plugh wrote: post #230
tlogan wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is important to understand that not all people who against vax mandates are anti-vaxers.

I thought about this for several moments, and I disagree. Vaccines offer some personal protection but predominantly become effective by achieving herd immunity. Vaccine hesitancy undermines this goal and weakens the system. Being pro-vaccine is senseless without being in favor of enough people being vaccinated to provide strong immunity, including for those who cannot be vaccinated due to medical complications. Even…

Ok I have more vaccines then the law requires because I went places where it made sense to get more shots for more disease.

I have not touched the COVID shot because I did not trust it for these reasons:

- vaccines take years to test not months - there were new untested biotech involved - in short order I was being told that it does not work for this flavor of COVID.

And now it is acknowledged to not protect you or prevent the spread of COVID.

How can you claim any social good here? it has bad side effects and does not work.

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#254

Post by spaetzleesser »

throwawaylinux wrote: post #151
spaetzleesser wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same happened in CA with some stores being open and others closed. Why was Home Depot open? It made no sense in terms of spreading the disease . It was just arbitrary BS. Closing the beaches was stupid too. If there ever was a safe place then it was the beach or state park wheee uou are in the open and the window blows.

People were rabidly cheering it on too. Police going around shutting playgrounds and arresting parents for playing outdoors with their children, while at the same time the politicians they voted for were constantly and egregiously shown to be flouting the rules on frivolities, parties, travel, fun. And there were excuses for the politicians and bloodlust for the commoner trying to exercise or raise their child. Absol…

“I used to wonder how on earth nazis and communists and the like were able to seize power and control of a population, and now I've seen it”

That’s how the US has worked for a long time. See the war on drugs and mass incarceration, laws against black people and extreme political polarization. There was always a group of “others” that people wanted to get punished.

I bet if Trump had been a little smarter he would have got away with a lot more while people cheering him on. But it seems a lot of political institutions are eroding so maybe the next strongman will be able to go way further.

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#255

Post by stjohnswarts »

tb_technical wrote: post #73

They took people's livelyhoods away, and now they gotta pay.

Not really, they were watching out for the health of other employees who had to work with employees that refused to do the most basic acts to prevent the spread of a deadly virus.

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#256

Post by spaetzleesser »

vineyardmike wrote: post #247
spaetzleesser wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do firefighters have no effect on tourism? Without them you can not run a city. Same for many other jobs like garbage collection.

> Same for many other jobs like garbage collection. Spoken like someone who hasn't been to New York. I love the city, its a fun and vibrant place. But they have some unusual trash policies (primarily they don't have alleys so trash has to be dumped on the main sidewalk) and wherever you go its not uncommon for the sidewalks to be lined with trash waiting for pickup.

I have been to New York and I have also seen Paris during a strike of garbage collectors. It gets ugly very quickly once collection stops.

The number one thing I have noticed in New York was they seem to make trash collection as loud as possible ideally at 3 in the morning :)

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#257

Post by stjohnswarts »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #161
Maursault wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They were fired for cause, namely, insubordination. The resistance to vaccination is entirely political. The mandate was not, but instead in the interests of public safety and health. Easing the mandate for special cases was a terrible decision. The decision to ease the mandate should be reversed, not the mandate itself. So quickly they've forgotten the piles of bodies of COVID victims in NYC.

> They were fired for cause, namely, insubordination The idea that you can order someone to perform a medical procedure because they work for you is disguisting. Where does this end?

What happens when a virus comes along that kills at a higher rate, say 35%? You're saying people should be willing to work alongside others when there is a 35% chance of a pandemic level virus killing you because a peer thinks science is dumb?

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#259

Post by DannyBee »

Alupis wrote: post #55
DannyBee wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This will get appealed. NY supreme court is just their basic trial court

That may be, but it is really difficult to see how anyone will honestly make a case this was not government overreach, and an arbitrary overreach at that. We'll have to let it play out...

Which part?

Speaking as a lawyer, reading this, it feels like it will be overturned almost immediately, and possibly reassigned to a different judge.

There is very little legal analysis, and a large amount of unnecessary, biased, diatribe.

Appeals courts rarely look kindly on that.

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#260

Post by colechristensen »

curiousgal wrote: post #249
colechristensen wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regardless of if they were the right thing to do, many of the various covid mandates being enacted through whatever form of decree really didn’t seem like they fit inside the authority of the government executives trying to enact them. Many were also made to be unenforceable so they’d never be tested in court while still influencing people. The rule of law is important and limiting the power of “rulers” to make large…

Us Americans are so obsessed with government overreach that you'd think our corporate overloads are actually treating us well and that the government is the bad guy. When the government wants to fuck us over, think what the NSA has been doing, they won't look for precedents so there's no point in treating every decision they make as a potential sliperry slope. Covid was/is killing people, vaccines prevent that, so va…

People like government overreach when they agree with it completely forgetting that they won’t always.

Rights aren’t just for your side.

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