I work in the space industry and follow SATCOM closely. This is a very competitive space. Companies like Viasat, Iridium and Inmarsat already work in this vertical. SpaceX beats all these companies from a marketing perspective, but the big question is will a LEO operator provide better coverage than a GEO operator?
Starlink Maritime
251–260 of 530 posts
Re: Starlink Maritime
#252Just curious. Does anyone know anyone who has received their terminal who is not a SpaceX employee or opted for Mobile/RV? I keep hearing about how they're being deployed, but the only people I know who have received their terminals are SpaceX employees or people who agreed to the more expensive Mobile/RV service.
Less anecdotally, Starlink passed 400,000 customers as of a month and a half or so ago [0]. I wouldn't be surprised if it was pushing towards the half million mark now or fairly soon. They're limited now in terms of terrestrial cell density primarily, and that cannot be solved without more and more powerful sats which can actually shrink the physical cell size and improve beam count and bandwidth. Mobile/RV is therefore useful for them because it's lower priority with no guarantees, but that's ok for that usage model. The times where it will tend to be very important are in remote areas where cells are not full, and the times where cells are full there is also more likelihood of LTE, and RV can by definition move around if necessary. Maritime (or aircraft for that matter) obviously also fits those current limits, the oceans are near empty of Starlink right now and it's high revenue per user given the competition.
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0: https://www.cnbc.com/2022/05/25/spacexs-starlink-surpasses-4...
Re: Starlink Maritime
#253Earlier quoted context omitted.
You are absolutely spot on. The market isn’t competitive, it’s artificial highway robbery to even be in business. The entry requirements and expenses are insanely high, preventing a lot of competition to begin with, and the few players are free to drive up their prices to disgusting altitudes while providing services of disgusting quality. I wouldn’t even be surprised if they have agreements going on between themselv…
Iridium’s profit margins do not seem like those of a company engaging in artificial highway robbery: https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/IRDM/iridium-commu... Neither do Viasat’s: https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/VSAT/viasat/profit... For some reason, Inmarsat has very nice profit margins though: https://craft.co/inmarsat/metrics Interesting that Viasat was able to purchase Inmarsat given the figures.
Re: Starlink Maritime
#254I work in the space industry and follow SATCOM closely. This is a very competitive space. Companies like Viasat, Iridium and Inmarsat already work in this vertical. SpaceX beats all these companies from a marketing perspective, but the big question is will a LEO operator provide better coverage than a GEO operator?
Re: Starlink Maritime
#255Earlier quoted context omitted.
You are absolutely spot on. The market isn’t competitive, it’s artificial highway robbery to even be in business. The entry requirements and expenses are insanely high, preventing a lot of competition to begin with, and the few players are free to drive up their prices to disgusting altitudes while providing services of disgusting quality. I wouldn’t even be surprised if they have agreements going on between themselv…
To be fair, a non vertically integrated geostationary-satellite-owning company like intelsat, ses, eutelsat or arabsat or similar has little to no control over how much Boeing charges for a fully equipped 702 series satellite bus, or the disposable rocket launch costs.
Re: Starlink Maritime
#256Earlier quoted context omitted.
https://www.starlink.com/rv -- If I had to guess part of the reason would maybe be carrying capacity - a house that doesn't move is predictable - RVs & boats move so the per satellite bandwidth predictability of that class of object is lower - i think meaning the requirements for redundancy are higher - redundancy is expensive? - just a guess --
Starlink RV is only currently meant to be used while stationary and can't track while in motion, which is why the hardware is identical to the home unit. They're supposed to be coming out with new hardware that allows use while in motion. It was only a week ago that the FCC approved the application for "vehicles in motion."[1] It will be on airplanes as well, soon. [1] https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/30/fcc-approves-spa…
Or even better: just flat beam-forming antenna on the RV roof. Once thing there is enough on the roof is space.
Re: Starlink Maritime
#257Earlier quoted context omitted.
Look at the coverage map: https://api.starlink.com/public-files/maritime-coverage-map.... What a fucking joke. "coming soon" means nothing to me coming from a Musk company. Compare to the iridum network: https://www.groundcontrol.com/us/knowledge/calculators-and-m... Granted, iridium is much slower. But $5k a month for barely any coverage is an insult.
-- coverage is literally perfect for anywhere I take my (imaginary) yacht! - south of france? check! italian riviera? check! miami? Check! LA? Check! $5k a month? In YachtLand $5/mth is pocket change --
Re: Starlink Maritime
#258Earlier quoted context omitted.
Look at the coverage map: https://api.starlink.com/public-files/maritime-coverage-map.... What a fucking joke. "coming soon" means nothing to me coming from a Musk company. Compare to the iridum network: https://www.groundcontrol.com/us/knowledge/calculators-and-m... Granted, iridium is much slower. But $5k a month for barely any coverage is an insult.
Do you think running Starlink is cheap? Something seems to have struck a nerve.
Re: Starlink Maritime
#259I've been looking forward to marine starlink with the thought of being able to work remotely while sailing. Then I saw the pricing! I guess they're aiming for the megayacht crowd not average shmoes on small boats. Interestingly it does look like people are putting starlink on sailboats with ok results: https://www.reddit.com/r/SailboatCruising/comments/vovaxs/st...
Re: Starlink Maritime
#260Earlier quoted context omitted.
The Mar 31, 2022 datapoint is -0.21%. They do make a good profit in the years they do, but my point is they also have quite a bit of volatility. I would not touch that business without the 10%+ profit margin opportunities.
Definitely agree, I probably wouldn't touch them at this point any more at all. Was just replying to the notion that this couldn't be artificial highway robbery just because their net margin isn't great. I believe it definitely still can be, because apparently the only way these companies are even in business right now is exactly by highway robbery.
If anything, it seems like the customers should feel lucky the investors are risking their money on this product/service, and it is being offered at all.