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How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

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Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#251

Post by coryfklein »

jonplackett wrote: post #181
numair wrote: post #133

I looked at the title, opened the link, searched for “Peter Arnell,” got zero results, and knew the article was total garbage. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/arnells-explanation-of-failed-t... I had a close friend who worked on a project where they brought this guy in. Charged $1m a month and invoiced his jet fuel to the company, if I remember correctly. Now you know where the $30M actually went. The article is an exam…

This article is massively over thinking it. The problem is the lack of a the word TROPICANA written really big on the carton. I doubt people ‘stopped relating to it’ because of the lack of straw. They just didn’t know it was Tropicana at a glance, figured it was sold out and bought something else.

The human brain processes and identifies images much MUCH faster than text. The prototypical figure cited is 60,000x faster. I don't know the source for that figure, but it makes inherent sense that the human eye can visually identify the shape of a juicy edible fruit much faster than it can read an english word.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#252

Post by tweetle_beetle »

mickael-kerjean wrote: post #156
Zamicol wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's him talking about the design: https://youtu.be/WJ4yF4F74vc?t=29

This is fascinating in the worst possible way. Lot of fancy words alongside "the purity of the juice" when the ingredient list is full of weird things the average consumer has no idea about

It's one of those things that's obvious if you think about it, but still blew my mind when I read about orange juice being blended like wine with various oils, etc to ensure consistency throughout the year and across huge production scale.

Probably the subliminal advertising image of the straw straighy into an orange from childhood.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#253

Post by ask_b123 »

Gareth321 wrote: post #249
runlevel1 wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's Arnell Group's explanation of their Pepsi Logo redesign: https://www.goldennumber.net/wp-content/uploads/pepsi-arnell... While I disagree about the heat map in the article being pseudoscience, I agree that Arnell's "design thinking" totally is.

This is an impressive level of bullshit. Like, this takes a degree and years of experience to bullshit at this calibre.

> [1 light year = 671 million miles per hour]

hmm

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#254

Post by donarb »

Kaotique wrote: post #185
makecheck wrote: post #35

What seems to be lost in these “redesigns” is the why : why are you doing it? If there isn’t a list of benefits long enough to justify the cost and possible risk, well, that’s a problem. There’s also a tendency for companies to be super proud of what they’ve done so they neglect methods like A/B testing and instead just bet the farm on their great new design. After all, it cost a lot of money and looks cool to the de…

I think a lot of times a redesign is simply used as a tool for a manager/exec to have an impact, any impact really. It does not matter so much if the net result is positive or negative. It looks good on their resume. "Joined company X and spearheading redesign project of X". Designer companies love it, they can let their imagination run wild and the managers will gobble up whatever they come up with. This happens on…

If I were the hiring manager, the first question I'd asked is, what were the results of that redesign?

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#255

Post by mushbino »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #221
iNerdier wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

C-level execs are the bullshit in these stories. They meddled with something that wasn’t broken and this was the result.

Logo Management is practically a cliche. Can't think what else to do to justify the big bucks? New Logo™! So articles like these completely miss the point of the commercial design industry. The goal isn't sales - never mind brand awareness. The goal is to make C-suite execs feel like they're doing something exciting, and maybe even a little creative. From that POV I'm sure the Tropicana rebrand was a huge success. An…

As someone who has worked in product design for many years, the most important part of the job is making sure bad changes and ideas don't get pushed out. Yes, making sure they don't do anything is a crucial part of the job and I'm always very busy with that part of things, especially if it's something that comes down from the C-level.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#256

Post by ryandrake »

mickael-kerjean wrote: post #156
Zamicol wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's him talking about the design: https://youtu.be/WJ4yF4F74vc?t=29

This is fascinating in the worst possible way. Lot of fancy words alongside "the purity of the juice" when the ingredient list is full of weird things the average consumer has no idea about

Listening to that verbal diarrhea, I had an unmistakable visceral reaction that George Carlin describes so well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UecRfBJ2LBM

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#257

Post by codys »

codys wrote: post #96
jan_Inkepa wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if some of the "why" isn't the general turn against straws in the current zeitgeist.

The article indicates the re-design in question was "launched" in January 2008. This is the date where planning the redesign began. Another article [1] indicates that the new design was deployed on January 8th, 2009, and Tropicana announced a return to the old design on February 23rd, 2009. A quick search shows an article [2] indicating around 2018 was when the panic around plastic straws began (with, for example, Se…

Whoops: I missed a "not" in the last sentence. Should be:

> So in this case, the plastic straw issue does _not_ necessarily appear to be related to the redesign.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#258

Post by mushbino »

runlevel1 wrote: post #240
numair wrote: post #133

I looked at the title, opened the link, searched for “Peter Arnell,” got zero results, and knew the article was total garbage. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/arnells-explanation-of-failed-t... I had a close friend who worked on a project where they brought this guy in. Charged $1m a month and invoiced his jet fuel to the company, if I remember correctly. Now you know where the $30M actually went. The article is an exam…

Here's Arnell Group's explanation of their Pepsi Logo redesign: https://www.goldennumber.net/wp-content/uploads/pepsi-arnell... While I disagree about the heat map in the article being pseudoscience, I agree that Arnell's "design thinking" totally is.

It looks like they're trying to force an art into a science and it's just ridiculously off the mark. I wonder if agencies have to do this thing to have something more concrete to prove to clients even if it's bullshit and they know it.

Also, it's pretty impressive seeing the Pepsi branding just get progressively worse over the years. It's a little out there by today's standards, but I kind of like the 1898 branding the best.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#259

Post by kazinator »

numair wrote: post #133

I looked at the title, opened the link, searched for “Peter Arnell,” got zero results, and knew the article was total garbage. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/arnells-explanation-of-failed-t... I had a close friend who worked on a project where they brought this guy in. Charged $1m a month and invoiced his jet fuel to the company, if I remember correctly. Now you know where the $30M actually went. The article is an exam…

I agree that the article would give more information if it gave the background information about the logo redesign, but that's not its topic; the topic is why the logo had problems, not how it originated.

> Now you know where the $30M actually went.

Do I? I have no idea how this loss figure is allocated between lost revenue, and wasted spending on the redesign itself. I'm supposed to believe your comment which insinuates that $30M went to some Arnell person, and nothing was actually lost, sales-wise.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#260

Post by [deleted] »

jonplackett wrote: post #181
numair wrote: post #133

I looked at the title, opened the link, searched for “Peter Arnell,” got zero results, and knew the article was total garbage. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/arnells-explanation-of-failed-t... I had a close friend who worked on a project where they brought this guy in. Charged $1m a month and invoiced his jet fuel to the company, if I remember correctly. Now you know where the $30M actually went. The article is an exam…

This article is massively over thinking it. The problem is the lack of a the word TROPICANA written really big on the carton. I doubt people ‘stopped relating to it’ because of the lack of straw. They just didn’t know it was Tropicana at a glance, figured it was sold out and bought something else.

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