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The sticky issue of consent in street photography

dinalitovsky.bulletin.com

251–260 of 292 posts

Re: The sticky issue of consent in street photography

#251

While people are constantly under surveillance of street cameras. While people are constantly under surveillance by their own phones and all kinds of apps. While people are constantly under surveillance during any internet activity . While most people agree to have computers that are not completely open which means no complete inspection of firmware and software including OS which means zero privacy by definition. Wh…

The other commenter is right to call your comment performative rudeness. You're acting like it's insane that the boiled frog is complaining about the water temperature. Meanwhile facebook just released sunglasses that can surreptitiously record everyone everywhere.

I merely bring attention back to the real issue: surveillance. Some times you need to deliver the truth to the 'boiling frog'. I would not call it rudeness though especially in comparison to what 'boiling frog' does to photographers.

I was literally threatened by a man with the dog ready to attack for making test video shots of different color modes in the center of the city in the public space. I was directing my camera to the ... well to the bush. Intentionally away from the people walking on the paved road. Intentionally not directing my camera to any property. Just a public bush growing in the public bush. Did it help? No! There was literally no one alive in the shots except that very bush itself. No people around by the way. Just this one 'normal' man coming from behind or in your terminology 'boiled frog' that was ready to question me in the middle of the public street and was threatening me with his dog if I do not comply with his requests. So talk to me about rudeness.

You may think it is one rare example? It is not. If you do street photography for some time you'll see many 'interesting' aggressive things directed toward you even by people who you intentionally avoided to put into the frame. At this stage if you prefer to name my small 'call for sanity' a rudeness I could not accept it, sorry.

>You're acting like it's insane that the boiled frog is complaining about the water temperature.

It is insane if 'boiled frog' is complaining about photography which has nothing to do with the real issue while 'boiled frog' should really complain about 'the water temperature' and many other things.

>Meanwhile facebook just released sunglasses that can surreptitiously record everyone everywhere.

Exactly my point. Direct complains where they belong and leave photographers alone. Let them do their hard job and keep society respectful toward freedom of artists. Without it society doomed to failure.

Re: The sticky issue of consent in street photography

#252

I would have read that article but I could not get past the sticky 'consent or go away' cookie banner.

Yeah, somehow the author/site still thinks it's a good idea to use Facebook's integration (there are FB comments under the article).

But on desktop, the Developer Tools helps, just open it, find the cookie overlay (div with class "__fb-light-mode"), and delete it. I didn't need to consent to whatever Zuck wanted...

Re: The sticky issue of consent in street photography

#253

IMO, street photography is a low art form. It's walking around without a plan, snapping random snapshots of people and expect some meaning to come out on its own. The creation process is regulated to pressing a button and some minor processing. Perhaps similar to throwing buckets of paint at a canvas and seeing what comes out. It's usually derivative. Someone alone looking sad because that's their resting face. A bla…

Feh, HONY... http://warscapes.com/opinion/sentimentality-critique-humans-...

> HONY presents photographs derived from this tradition but divorced from its vast potential for social import. Its brand of “humanity” requires no scrutiny, for it is designed to do what photography’s critics have accused the medium of doing at its worst: to capture, to possess, and to provoke in the viewer unprocessable, useless emotion.

Re: The sticky issue of consent in street photography

#255
post #190

While people are constantly under surveillance of street cameras. While people are constantly under surveillance by their own phones and all kinds of apps. While people are constantly under surveillance during any internet activity . While most people agree to have computers that are not completely open which means no complete inspection of firmware and software including OS which means zero privacy by definition. Wh…

I live in a country where surveillance cameras can only be used, in most cases, to investigate crimes. (although the government is trying hard to change this, lately). Photography of public space is allowed, but if the subject is a specific person, you must obtain permission. This also leaves an awkward gray area for things like dashcams, which can be considered unregistered surveillance cameras and as such are not a…

>Photography of public space is allowed, but if the subject is a specific person, you must obtain permission.

Sorry but then it is called 'Not allowed' If you need to ask any permission.

By the way it seems that it never occur to those people who adapted such laws to ask the basic question : Why right for artistic expression should be 'allowed' by them? Who are they to allow other person to perceive the world in a certain way and express it in some artistic form or another? The freedom of speech and freedom of artistic expression as part of it can and should be protected if society wish to flourish and be free. The nature of the right suggests that no majority or authority can take away your right.

>I live in a country where surveillance cameras can only be used, in most cases, to investigate crimes. (although the government is trying hard to change this, lately).

I especially loved this part : "in most cases"

If this country is full of people who cannot respect artistic freedom It would be foolish for the gov. not to abuse them further.

This is exactly what you pay when you disrespect artists. No surprise there. You pay with your own freedom and you sacrifice freedom of the society itself. Is that is such a difficult concept to grasp in your country?

By the way in one such country or presumably this very country I was almost attacked even for walking with camera. No pictures where taken at all. Talk to me about 'allowed'...

In Germany turns out people think that they are entitled to posses pictures they never made. They think it's their pictures failing to understand that it's never them on pictures it is what artist see in them or about them on artist's picture. When fools starting to dominate and take freedom of artist to express himself the payment will come and it will be much much worse then arguably such a little discomfort of someone taking picture with you on it.

Re: The sticky issue of consent in street photography

#256

This will be an unpopular opinion but I feel someone taking a photo with me as the subject without my permission is almost on par with assault It feels like a huge invasion of my personal space, regardless of whether or not the photographer is in my face or not.

I can feel the same about people looking at me without my permission. Is there a difference between the two?

Re: The sticky issue of consent in street photography

#257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It absolutely is boolean for some people. If I'm in a public space w/o an expectation of privacy you have every right to photograph me. Same goes for my daughter, bathing-suit or street-clothes. I value the right of others to make photos in public spaces and I recognize that it applies to me as a subject.

I don't think you'd be ok with someone that would come to your house every morning to take pictures of your daughter that goes to school. You'll call police on day two if that happened.

Because it's stalking?

Re: The sticky issue of consent in street photography

#258

While people are constantly under surveillance of street cameras. While people are constantly under surveillance by their own phones and all kinds of apps. While people are constantly under surveillance during any internet activity . While most people agree to have computers that are not completely open which means no complete inspection of firmware and software including OS which means zero privacy by definition. Wh…

This is the best comment I've read on HN in a good while. Photography and consent here appear to be a logical example of what Umberto Eco called the hyper-real, the thing that is a supersaturated version of itself which draws the eye, thereby distracting from the ubiquity of the more discreet (yet totalizing) examples of the same thing in the environment–usually serving the interests of accumulated power. The shadow…

Thank you very much for your kind words. And there are two mentioned people to explore. Thank you for that too. I just love exploring smart people.Can't get enough of it since I have no direct access to such people around me. And it is those mentions that encourage people to do so. I have discovered most amazing things for myself thanks to such mentions.

Re: The sticky issue of consent in street photography

#259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right; with the notable exception of value provided by governments, which largely comes out of the pockets of the working class.

"Money coming out of pockets" isn't evidence that value is "taken" from anywhere. The more cooperative exchanges of value we have, the more valuable and prosperous our economies are.

This reminds me of PG's essay: http://www.paulgraham.com/wealth.html

"A surprising number of people retain from childhood the idea that there is a fixed amount of wealth in the world."

Re: The sticky issue of consent in street photography

#260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are we talking about rights or your convenience? Does a person has a right to freely express himself in any art form including photography?

This is a response to the parent, which said: > As people have mentioned, security cameras are filming me all the time - and I've no issue with that. > If one of these frames was taken by a photographer deliberately - then suddenly I care more. Why did he take it? What was I doing? Where will it be shown? To whom will it be shown? What will they think of me, based upon it etc etc. I was just expanding on that. But go…

>I was just expanding on that.

Yes you were just explaining on that but you 'were explaining on that' purely from the convenience and point of view while if you think about right for the free speech it is frequently not so much convenient when you hear criticism. That is why I asked the question and the question stands.

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