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Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

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Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#251

Post by redisman »

varjag wrote: post #63
lordnacho wrote: post #32

I would guess people evaluate their job on money/work/stink axes. All of FAANG pays well, so what's left is whether the work is interesting/important/fulfilling and whether the company has integrity/evil issues. Eg you might think F1 has interesting problems despite glorifying fossil fuel cars, or you might think drones are technically challenging despite being used to kill people. Loads of people become nurses and t…

I assume they genuinely struggle with recruiting. Getting cold recruiting mails from FB lately despite being on the wrong continent. They must be scraping the bottom.

Everyone is. Amazon was hitting me up constantly in SEA and I’d imagine every other Engineer here too

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#252

Post by crate_barre »

ethbr0 wrote: post #233
dismalpedigree wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Facebook…erhm Meta.. makes cool and useful services. My uneducated guess is about 20% of their efforts go to delivering something compelling to the user. The remainder goes to figure out how they can manipulate, coerce, farm, and monetize said users. The problem is the level of perversion they have done and justified due to the need to monetize.

I had a guy pitch me on Comcast's tech office once. He said you get to work on cool stuff, but it never actually gets deployed. And that everyone hates your employer, but you'll never get fired. I definitely see how "work on cool stuff" + "don't worry about getting fired" could be pretty cool, if you don't have any investment in really creating things that are used.

That value proposition of stability is a high for those that have a life outside of work. Why does a typical engineer optimize for leetcode and FAANG salaries? Because they have shit else to establish self respect.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#253

Post by wtetzner »

perdid0 wrote: post #71

> Out of more than 1,100 votes, the person was urged to take the Netflix job, where he said he was being offered $580,000 a year. Are these real salaries? How??

Well, they call it total compensation, and it includes salary, bonus, and RSUs.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#254

Post by coryrc »

samplatt wrote: post #231
rhexs wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most teachers absolutely do get a 3 month break. They’ll have a few workshops at most.

People in here seem to be using "most" to mean "people I know personally". To add another data point, every teacher I know uses at least a third of their "break" for lesson planning. Usually more.

And some tech workers work 12 hours/day. That's on them for making poor decisions.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#255

Post by ryan_lane »

throoo0ooowaway wrote: post #248

I recently went through the interview processes for FB and another (non-FAANG) company mentioned elsewhere in this thread, and it was stunning how different the processes were. The recruiter for FB was incapable of conveying the simplest information in a period of time less than 30 minutes and constantly seemed to misremember what information they had already given me; they were constantly setting (and missing) deadl…

The negotiating without an offer thing is a normal (and very annoying) tactic used by recruiters to give you an offer that you immediately accept, while being able to avoid giving you an actual offer that you may reject. Recruiters have metrics they need to hit that include acceptance/rejection on offers, and this is a way they juice their metrics.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#256

Post by filoleg »

Der_Einzige wrote: post #172
mkl95 wrote: post #22

This is an entirely subjective take, but in the last few years FB seem to have evolved from one the coolest places for an engineer to being at the bottom of FAANG. I wonder if a significant amount of those people are looking for positions at Google/Amazon or they are taking their expertise somewhere else.

Oh delusional amazonians thinking they can successfully prevent those in the know for lobbying for their removal from "FAANG". Amazon is by far the lowest of the FAANG. Horrific WLB, worse pay than all others listed (esp the vesting schedule), toxic culture, terrible benefits (lol bananas). Don't delude yourself, Facebook is a great place to work and actually deserves to stay in the acronym

Fully agreed with your comment, but I wanted to correct one small thing regarding vesting schedule.

Recently, it seems like Amazon started to offset their poor vesting schedule in the first 2 years by giving the matching amount of cash bonus for those years of reduced vest. So technically, you still get only 5%/15% vested during your first two years, but with enough cash bonus for those two years to essentially make your "vest amount" equal to the real vest during years 3 and 4.

Note: I haven't done this myself as I am not interviewing with Amazon for all the other reasons you listed, but I had a few friends who interviewed with them in the past year. At first, I thought it was just a unique situation my friends managed to negotiate for themselves. But after checking the usual sources (r/cscareerquestions and a few other places online), it seems like my friends were far from being unique in that aspect, as I saw quite a few people reporting the same cash-bonus-offset method over the past year. From what I saw, it seems like a new thing they started doing at some point during COVID.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#257

Post by throoo0ooowaway »

dmead wrote: post #207
grp000 wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't been following FB, and wasn't aware that Zuckerberg could be liable for more than financial penalties. Is it regarding Cambridge Analytics? https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2021/10/20/tech...

he's talking about how they may have misrepresented the business of the company to investors. the SEC has ongoing stuff about this.

This is where Matt Levine would opine "everything is securities fraud".

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#258

Post by Infinitesimus »

filoleg wrote: post #256
Der_Einzige wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh delusional amazonians thinking they can successfully prevent those in the know for lobbying for their removal from "FAANG". Amazon is by far the lowest of the FAANG. Horrific WLB, worse pay than all others listed (esp the vesting schedule), toxic culture, terrible benefits (lol bananas). Don't delude yourself, Facebook is a great place to work and actually deserves to stay in the acronym

Fully agreed with your comment, but I wanted to correct one small thing regarding vesting schedule. Recently, it seems like Amazon started to offset their poor vesting schedule in the first 2 years by giving the matching amount of cash bonus for those years of reduced vest. So technically, you still get only 5%/15% vested during your first two years, but with enough cash bonus for those two years to essentially make…

Amazon has had a large cash comp for years 1 and 2 for a very long time. It's not new because of covid at all.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#259

Post by crate_barre »

version_five wrote: post #198
lordnacho wrote: post #32

I would guess people evaluate their job on money/work/stink axes. All of FAANG pays well, so what's left is whether the work is interesting/important/fulfilling and whether the company has integrity/evil issues. Eg you might think F1 has interesting problems despite glorifying fossil fuel cars, or you might think drones are technically challenging despite being used to kill people. Loads of people become nurses and t…

> What you're less likely to do is work in an area where your work isn't interesting, contributes nothing significant, and rots people's minds. Have you head of finance? What I think is that most current tech folks started their careers out of genuine interest, and so think along the lines you describe. But now that the money has really arrived, the balance will shift to the type-A aspirational folks who only care ab…

We’ve crossed the Rubican on the injection of type-a’s in this field. The entire Agile layer is one hell of a ruse where they managed to employ an entire group of unnecessary people into what used to be a very natural workflow. I really don’t need a scrum master asking me every morning what the fuck I did yesterday, or size stories every other day. Believe me, I really don’t.

I almost want finance to be glamorized again so it can siphon these people away.

Re: Facebook employees are now more willing to leave, tech recruiters say

#260

Post by filoleg »

waltbosz wrote: post #175
erehweb wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What incentive would any individual company have to join such a blacklist? Re 1, California says you can't refuse to hire someone because of criminal history ( https://www.shouselaw.com/ca/labor/discrimination/ban-the-bo... ), so refusing to hire b/c they worked for FB sounds like it would be doubtful.

I didn't really imagine any sort of incentive to join the pact. The motivation to join would be something akin to a protest against facebook's product. The goal would be to make it more difficult for facebook's product to exist. I did consider laws that prohibit asking about criminal history. I don't think those specific laws would apply, as they are designed to help the previously incarcerated re-enter society throu…

> I didn't really imagine any sort of incentive to join the pact. The motivation to join would be something akin to a protest against facebook's product.

The second a company does something like this (aka no real incentive event that can only potentially cause damage, solely as a "protest") is the second that company is going to look like a pretty bad place to work at. Mostly because it just means they care more about public outrage and putting on a show than actually doing their work.

And despite not having much interest in working for FB, I have way less interest in working at a place where other employees (and the leadership) are supportive of such proposals.

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