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Japanese people may have gained longevity by balancing their diets

economist.com

251–260 of 268 posts

Re: Japanese people may have gained longevity by balancing their diets

#251

Some observations... 1) Japan is not built around cars. There are more trains. You get to walk more. 2) Food portions are smaller, making it harder to overeat. 3) Fish is more popular than meat. Fish section in supermarkets is larger. Most kitchens have fish cooking equipment. 4) They do not put cheese in goddamn everything. I guess they get to eat more mercury (from fish) and arsenic (from rice).

Fish also has selenium which can apparently counteract the effect of mercury by forming complexes.

Re: Japanese people may have gained longevity by balancing their diets

#252

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The Mindspan Diet, by Preston Estep has a lot to say about the Japanese diet. I think he makes many convincing arguments. Some key take-aways: Iron is very bad for longevity, refined carbs that aren't sugar and that have relatively low glycemic indexes (long grained rice and many pastas) are actually quite good (rice/pasta), meat bad but seafood ok, don't over do the saturated fat in general, drink moderate alcohol i…

Seafood specifically can't be judged as some ideal one 200 years ago prior to oceans pollution. If you want to pick up seafood which is not heavily contaminated by heavy metals, various regional spills, factory drains, near deltas of biggest rivers in Asia/Africa etc. you will find out you just play russian roulette with your food. Mercury poisoning with ie tuna can be achieved relatively quickly depending on the bra…

I'm mostly a vegetarian except that I do take molecularly distilled fish oil. Very simple way to get some of the health benefits of seafood consumption but take no risk.

However, I actually feel mercury isn't nearly the bugaboo that vegan proponents often make it out to be. High ocean mercury levels have been a thing for over 100 years. Yet a great many studies have found seafood to be beneficial to longevity and overall health.

All of your points sound like vegan talking points, but to each their own.

Re: Japanese people may have gained longevity by balancing their diets

#253

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There's a multitude of reasons, touched upon in a metastudy of inappropriate lab testing in medicine [1,2]: > “But, unexpectedly, on a per-test basis, we actually found that the main problem was tests being over-ordered during a patient’s initial examination, rather than during repeat tests. This indicates to us that ordering the right test during the initial evaluation may lead to fewer errors and better patient car…

I appreciate all those considerations but prevention of disease is all about identifying issues that may disrupt ones current feelings of and actual healthy state. We cannot keep waiting for randomized experimental research to identify all the ways health may degrade over time. If we can regularly gather data en masse, we regularly over time can identify more predictors and risk factors for poor (and good) health, an…

Some tests not only don’t benefit patients when done without reason, they actually harm them. medical interventions and procedures are often invasive and not without side effects, including pain, severe disability, and death. In many cases the studies you allude to us waiting for have arrived, and they show active harm for many cases where you’d think “why not add a test, what’s the harm”. Unfortunately medicine is still way too complex to reason about without the research to back it.

Re: Japanese people may have gained longevity by balancing their diets

#254
post #228

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I’ve had those experiences in China, my friends would often comment on my weight. They never meant it in a offensive way, but it’s still hurtful.

Well did it work?

It did actually.

Re: Japanese people may have gained longevity by balancing their diets

#255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like you have some divergent ideas here. On the one hand, you ask about practical, actionable stuff; on the other hand, you ask "How many consecutive generations of people living to 100 does it take before it happens at a regular basis.". The answer to the latter question is not something you can really use for anything. I sometimes wonder if the right thing for westerners wouldn't just be a big sequence of pho…

Do all Japanese actually eat that healthy? I can believe it of some of them, but there’s little fruit and many salarymen seem to live on a diet of fried chicken, hard liquor and cigarettes.

This does not really comport with the restaurant menus that I saw.

When you say they seem to live off this diet, what are you basing that on?

Re: Japanese people may have gained longevity by balancing their diets

#256
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do all Japanese actually eat that healthy? I can believe it of some of them, but there’s little fruit and many salarymen seem to live on a diet of fried chicken, hard liquor and cigarettes.

>many salarymen seem to live on a diet of fried chicken, hard liquor and cigarettes. That's what surprised me the most visiting Japan. All the skinny people in Japan eating fried chicken, fried mashed potatoes, fried everything. The only thing I could make out for why they were skinny was insane levels of portion control. Since they definitely didn't have time to do sports.

They are eating a lot of other food, actually; and that's why it works.

Re: Japanese people may have gained longevity by balancing their diets

#257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I appreciate all those considerations but prevention of disease is all about identifying issues that may disrupt ones current feelings of and actual healthy state. We cannot keep waiting for randomized experimental research to identify all the ways health may degrade over time. If we can regularly gather data en masse, we regularly over time can identify more predictors and risk factors for poor (and good) health, an…

Some tests not only don’t benefit patients when done without reason, they actually harm them. medical interventions and procedures are often invasive and not without side effects, including pain, severe disability, and death. In many cases the studies you allude to us waiting for have arrived, and they show active harm for many cases where you’d think “why not add a test, what’s the harm”. Unfortunately medicine is s…

In my field of nutrition alone, there is tons more we could do to individualize and thus improve the targets for macro and micronutrients, as just one example. RDAs are only a rough starting point (when there is an RDA) as we understand more about individual genetics, food environment, etc. Why is all of medicine just invasive procedures and pharma? I'm not convinced that we somehow just need to sit and wait for some future time before we can jnvest and safely make use of markers over ones life to improve behaviors and health outcomes (for the benefit of an individual and others with similar medical characteristics).

Theres room to debate the degree and depth that we would utilize labs and other measures, but a complete non-starter mentality just leaves health outcomes to blind fate and promotes development of complex conditions much more difficult to unwind.

Re: Japanese people may have gained longevity by balancing their diets

#258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does seem like it's offensive in america to mention overweightedness at all, which seems like it enables overweight people to ignore it. Seems unhealthy as well, both physically and mentally.

In American culture being fat is seen as a moral failing. Calling people out who already know they are overweight is offensive. You aren’t telling them something they don’t know. Likely they have already tried to lose weight and failed.

What's wrong with calling people out for a moral failing? It's more polite to ignore and pretend it hasn't happened, but it's a bit insane too, isn't it?

Re: Japanese people may have gained longevity by balancing their diets

#259

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The more I try to read, the less I know, the more I believe the answer is: - eat few - eat varied - move more - be with others - sleep nice Basically, avoid modern lifestyle advice.

Follow this advice and you'll increase your chances of growing older increases quite a lot, and you'll stay healthier in your older years as well. There is only so far these things can take us though. A lot of (but still too little) research is being done on slowing down or maybe even reversing aging, which could increase our lifespan to 150 (or maybe even longer). Not only would we live longer, but we would stay hea…

Why brushing teeth is so important?

Re: Japanese people may have gained longevity by balancing their diets

#260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s unlikely the problem will be solved until we can get some agreement on what is causing it. There isn’t consensus on this one. Why are people now overweight in many countries when they weren’t 50 years ago? What changed?

Your using it. The computer. All the interesting things in the world compressed into a device that you mostly use while immobile. Also, cost per calorie has never been lower, so technology has made it super cheap to feed us.

Are you sure? I would put it now down to the increased usage of cars.
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