Nubank acquires Cognitect • Hacker News Board

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#251

Post by lukashrb » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 8:34 AM UTC

mping wrote: post #242

lukashrb wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting view. What are the 'out of the box functionalities' which Clojure is lacking? Keep in mind Clojure provides Java interop and with clojurescript js interop. The clojure ecosystem has also pretty great libraries to work with. For example take a look at fulcro or re-frame, also metosin works on some really great libraries and there is much more.

I can tell you what I miss: really good error messages :)

Touché :D, but to be fair the Clojure-Team (i guess Alex mostly) put a lot effort in it to improve the situation.

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#252

Post by gdsdfe » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 10:08 AM UTC

riadvargas wrote: post #186

gdsdfe wrote: post #152

Anyone have an idea on the nubank stack in a bit more details?

Here you can get a somewhat updated view on Nubank's stack: https://stackshare.io/nubank/nubank

Yeah thanks I saw this page ... I was just trying to understand the Plataformatec acquisition and how it fits in the stack

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#253

Post by dustingetz » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 10:45 AM UTC

adamtait wrote: post #248

dustingetz wrote: post #14

The bull case here is if Nubank goes full Amazon and uses banking as a beachhead to create the next layer up from AWS, which Clojure/Datomic is amazingly perfect for – data all the things

Ha! I was going to reply to this comment - "If you're interested in data-all-the-things, then you should take a look at Hyperfiddle" - until I recognized the user handle and realized that you already knew about Hyperfiddle. (for those reading along, dustingetz built Hyperfiddle)

still building! we killed the saas thing for now and are releasing a web framework soon - declarative crud apps from nothing but function defs, specs, and datomic! All IO is managed and composes like Datomic Peer fns compose. Userland has no async, error handling etc. Complex pickers with typeahead search, query params etc are declared in one LOC

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#254

Post by travisjungroth » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 11:10 AM UTC

dbancajas wrote: post #89

can one make a career out of clojure?

People do it. And I’m trying to hire two Clojure devs.

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#255

Post by samtechie » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 11:32 AM UTC

praveenperera wrote: post #8

First plataformatec (company behind elixir) now this. Interesting.

It was more of an aquahire and Jose Valim the creator of Elixir left Plataformatec to start his own consultancy. All assets related to Elixir were transferred to the community. The rest of the core contributors are not affiliated to Plataformatec therefore the acquisition had no effect on Elixir.

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#256

Post by tome » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 11:41 AM UTC

dustingetz wrote: post #225

riku_iki wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it would not have been possible without these languages What critical features Clojure has, which don't exist in other platforms/languages?

Lisp + immutability is the right foundation for symbolic/logic programming, datalog, declarative programming, graph programming. None of this is really feasible in other langs due to bad ergonomics and no coordinated ecosystem buyin. Haskell lacks platform portability and Scala 2 is just too complicated to think clearly about anything high level.

What is "platform portability"?

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#257

Post by LeonidasXIV » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 12:22 PM UTC

myth_drannon wrote: post #105

clj_throwaway wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you asked me that 15 years ago, I'd say "no". In hindsight, it sort of makes sense given their objective of increasing time spent online and the quality of the experience. The proposition here is that nubank will be the first bank to successfully turn into a software vendor. Maybe my worries will be nothing in 10 years, but no one can say its an obvious outcome.

Bloomberg and Jane street (not banks but still finance). They don't own OCaml but are heavily involved in its development.

Bloomberg has sponsored BuckleScript in the beginning, but now it is sponsored by Facebook. Other than that their influence on OCaml development is minimal (and technically BuckleScript is a fork of the OCaml compiler).

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#258

Post by elbear » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 12:53 PM UTC

orolle wrote: post #107

hk__2 wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is nature of the problem space which requires you to produce high quality code. Wouldn’t a strongly-typed language be a better choice here?

I do not think so. The regulation is constantly changing and the meaning of names change frequently. Thus a "Verified Account" can mean different things over the years. The problem with types and object orientation is, that the names used in the domain diverge from the name used in source code (class name, types). Think about a class diagram with class names relating to each other. To represent the domain language be…

Standard Chartered, Mercury, Tsuru Capital (Haskell), Jane Street (OCaml) don't seem to have a problem with using a statically typed language in the financial space.

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#259

Post by hestefisk » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 1:11 PM UTC

jonahbenton wrote: post #112

dgb23 wrote: post #26

Nubank has a very inspiring story, both for engineers that are fans of Clojure & Datomic and for entrepreneurs that want to do "crazy" things like entering the bank sector. This must be very validating and exciting for both Cognitect and Nubank. I'm excited of the future impact on Clojure and Datomic. I get the impression that _all_[0] involved parties deeply care about what made them great so far. [0] I'm getting th…

Yeah, I saw the Nubank folks present in person in NYC just prior to COVID. I am a Clojure fan, to be sure, and also a banking/money dweeb. Soup to nuts it was one of the most impressive presentations / achievements I have seen. They were clearly operating in the future. Congrats to both and looking forward to growing the community. Plans to release a SAAS banking core in the US? Pretty please?

Literally ‘functional banking’ :)

Re: Nubank acquires Cognitect

#260

Post by eigenhombre » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 1:23 PM UTC

dbancajas wrote: post #89

can one make a career out of clojure?

Full-time in Clojure since early 2014; the jobs found me even before I had professional Clojure experience. There is definitely work out there... we have been hiring nearly continuously in Chicago for the past few years: junior, midlevel and senior alike. This took a pause for COVID-19 but I expect that to end soon.

Your mileage may vary, and I don't think the language is for everyone, but it is very satisfying to work with and it's putting groceries on the table for lots of people. (I'm happy to discuss more; contact info is in my profile.)