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Data structures and algorithms I actually used while working at tech companies
251–260 of 547 posts
Re: Data structures and algorithms I actually used while working at tech companies
#252I'm increasingly convinced that Algorithms-and-Data-Structure interviews are essentially being used as a proxy for: - General IQ. Can this person understand and apply complex ideas - Grit. Is this person hard-working enough to learn things that take time and effort It's the software equivalent of the NFL scouting combine. The goal is not to create a test that is similar to the day-to-day job. But rather, create a tes…
Algorithms and Data Structures don't measure either of those things. General IQ is not measured by very specific technical problems. Nor is learning something specific an indication of "grit". It's a proxy for interviewers to jerk their ego.
> General IQ is not measured by very specific technical problems.
I do not see data and algorithm interviews as very specific technical problems.
I do not have a computer science background, and have been able to bring myself up to speed to the general level expected without too much hassle.
I don't think I'm particularly special. I just searched and spent some time learning this stuff over a few weekends. If you are serious about a career, I don't really think that this is too much of an ask.
Re: Data structures and algorithms I actually used while working at tech companies
#253I'm increasingly convinced that Algorithms-and-Data-Structure interviews are essentially being used as a proxy for: - General IQ. Can this person understand and apply complex ideas - Grit. Is this person hard-working enough to learn things that take time and effort It's the software equivalent of the NFL scouting combine. The goal is not to create a test that is similar to the day-to-day job. But rather, create a tes…
Algorithms and Data Structures don't measure either of those things. General IQ is not measured by very specific technical problems. Nor is learning something specific an indication of "grit". It's a proxy for interviewers to jerk their ego.
> It's a proxy for interviewers to jerk their ego.
Interviewers don't have choice here. Interviewers aren't free to come up with their own method.
So this is not a valid explanation.
Re: Data structures and algorithms I actually used while working at tech companies
#254I'm increasingly convinced that Algorithms-and-Data-Structure interviews are essentially being used as a proxy for: - General IQ. Can this person understand and apply complex ideas - Grit. Is this person hard-working enough to learn things that take time and effort It's the software equivalent of the NFL scouting combine. The goal is not to create a test that is similar to the day-to-day job. But rather, create a tes…
If you're working on a large scale project you wouldn't be implementing a specific algorithm by yourself anyway. You'd be discussing a specific problem and then discussing the pros and cons of different algorithms that you want to implement and implementing POCs in different algorithms. The interview is just to see if you can think and discuss in terms of algorithms and data structures.
Re: Data structures and algorithms I actually used while working at tech companies
#255It's like in any competitive exam where there are too many candidates and not enough positions. If you ever look at the type of math and science problems on Chinese university exams they are not necessarily advance in terms of the topic but they are extremely tricky. A electromagnetism question testing your knowledge of Gauss' law usually in a regular setting would use a charged sphere or some other object with geome…
> too many candidates and not enough positions.
so sad, some of these smart and talented engineers will take the failure personally. The system needs to change, the only way we can progress is to not waste talent like this. We cannot rely on a small set of institutions (Harvard, Oxford, IIT etc) to output a small group of "elite" engineers, surely the world would be better if everybody that wanted to become an engineer had access to "elite" level education. Top companies have one major complaint: not enough engineers.
Bootcamps don't help either, what you want is that "elite" education with a bootcamp price, possibly many bootcamps over time, as skill sets need to adapt and grow.
Re: Data structures and algorithms I actually used while working at tech companies
#256I don't think the issue is DS&A or even leetcode problems in general.
I think the problem is being expected to regurgitate* 1-2 hyperoptimal leetcode solutions in 45 minutes while suffering from heavy interview pressure.
*by regurgitate, you can't simply implement the optimal solution either even if you know it. You have to put on a show where it seems like you're arriving at and iterating towards the optimal solution, "explaining your thought processes". But you can't waste time iterating and going down suboptimal paths either because you only have 45 minutes or less. Hence why ideally you know the exact optimal solution beforehand, or at least know the tricks and patterns to quickly get to the optimal solution for the type of problem you are tackling.
Recruiters and official interview guides say that your "thought processes" matter a lot, but reports from in the field tend to imply that the #1 most important factor is that you get the optimal solution. If you can't, your "thought processes" are worth little, barring exceptional circumstances.
Re: Data structures and algorithms I actually used while working at tech companies
#257I'm increasingly convinced that Algorithms-and-Data-Structure interviews are essentially being used as a proxy for: - General IQ. Can this person understand and apply complex ideas - Grit. Is this person hard-working enough to learn things that take time and effort It's the software equivalent of the NFL scouting combine. The goal is not to create a test that is similar to the day-to-day job. But rather, create a tes…
Unfortunately, those kinds of interviews also select for some other things that they shouldn't.
* Youth. People who have very recently studied these things in school, and use the same languages as the interviewers, have an advantage.
* Free time. People who have families (for example) might have less free time to study "Cracking the Code Interview" and such.
* Absence of anxiety. This disadvantages women, minorities, and people with psychological conditions that should be covered by ADA. Also, people whose financial situation is precarious will be more anxious than those who don't need the job, independent of which is actually a better candidate.
* Conformity. People who can recognize the flaws in a measurement technique, and who have the strength of character to push back against its application - both good qualities for a candidate - will self select out.
There's a lot of overlap among these, of course. There are better ways to measure "general IQ" and "grit" (which are both questionable concepts anyway). I've passed every such interview I've ever taken, but I refuse to administer them (despite the fact that my refusal has carried a quite tangible cost) because whatever benefit they provide is outweighed by their many flaws.
Re: Data structures and algorithms I actually used while working at tech companies
#258I'm increasingly convinced that Algorithms-and-Data-Structure interviews are essentially being used as a proxy for: - General IQ. Can this person understand and apply complex ideas - Grit. Is this person hard-working enough to learn things that take time and effort It's the software equivalent of the NFL scouting combine. The goal is not to create a test that is similar to the day-to-day job. But rather, create a tes…
Algorithms and Data Structures don't measure either of those things. General IQ is not measured by very specific technical problems. Nor is learning something specific an indication of "grit". It's a proxy for interviewers to jerk their ego.
It isn't this black and white
It can be both
From my experience, when you have a big pool of candidates, the ones that pass not necessarily super stars, but they tend to perform at a relative stable level.
Re: Data structures and algorithms I actually used while working at tech companies
#259I'm increasingly convinced that Algorithms-and-Data-Structure interviews are essentially being used as a proxy for: - General IQ. Can this person understand and apply complex ideas - Grit. Is this person hard-working enough to learn things that take time and effort It's the software equivalent of the NFL scouting combine. The goal is not to create a test that is similar to the day-to-day job. But rather, create a tes…
- Retention. If this person spent hours on leetcode, they’ll be less likely to leave the job knowing the effort it takes to get through the gate
I'll disagree with this one. I'd actually be inclined to job-hop more frequently if I have the skill to pass hard interviews at any tier 1 company, thus maximizing my earnings.
If I don't, I just stay put knowing I lucked out at a great company, knowing it would be hard to get lucky again.
Re: Data structures and algorithms I actually used while working at tech companies
#260I'm increasingly convinced that Algorithms-and-Data-Structure interviews are essentially being used as a proxy for: - General IQ. Can this person understand and apply complex ideas - Grit. Is this person hard-working enough to learn things that take time and effort It's the software equivalent of the NFL scouting combine. The goal is not to create a test that is similar to the day-to-day job. But rather, create a tes…
Depending on how you conduct them, they are actually stress tests: https://medium.com/@gameweld/the-case-for-the-private-techni... .
Given how brutal an on-call can be, perhaps this is the real reason?