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No evidence that testosterone reduces cognitive empathy

penntoday.upenn.edu

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Re: No evidence that testosterone reduces cognitive empathy

#251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So do you believe they're absurd?

Do I believe what are absurd? I've already had enough equivocation for one thread, please be specific when you post. I looked at the first two lists of gender identities my search returned and there were plenty of absurd categories (like Maverique and Novigender ). In addition, the idea that public policy and law should revolve around people choosing their identities on a day to day basis is, I believe, unworkable, i…

You've said a few times that "No one is arguing for disrespect of anyone", but the case you quote does argue that point explicitly.

He knew his stance would cause offence and even harm. His argument was that his employers should ignore that because of his convention rights to religious freedom.

> It is deeply disturbing that this is the first time in the history of English law that a judge has ruled that free citizens must engage in compelled speech

For one thing this isn't anything like the first case where the courts have found that a company hasn't done something wrong for firing an employee for not saying what the company wants them to say.

But also that judgment isn't saying anything of the sort. You're quoting an extremist Christian organisation who bring futile cases to court in order to make political points. https://nearlylegal.co.uk/2018/04/on-the-naughty-step-the-qu...

The judgment is saying that when you're a doctor employed by a government department you'll have to obey the law and the government department's policies. Note that the judgment doesn't force this doctor to use any particular pronoun, it only says that the government department can fire him.

And, in this particular context, everything about the meetings the doctor had with service users was "compelled" speech -- there's literally a template the doctor has to read from.

His legal team didn't attempt a freedom of speech defence. They tried to use a discrimination against religious beliefs defence, and that failed because...

> It was confirmed by the representatives at the start of the hearing that it was agreed that Dr Mackereth did not assert that he was treated less favourably than a person who, for reasons unrelated to Christianity or other belief refused to comply with the DWP’s gender reassignment or equal opportunities policy

Here's the judgment: https://christianconcern.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/CC-R...

Re: No evidence that testosterone reduces cognitive empathy

#252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If only I understood! Please, supply a single example of non-toxic masculinity that doesn't require your redefinition of commonly understood words and maybe I'll be able to understand better. You can hardly blame me for misunderstanding something you fail so badly at elucidating.

Toxic masculinity refers to traditional cultural masculine norms that can be harmful to men, women, and society overall; this concept of toxic masculinity is not intended to demonize men or male attributes, but rather to emphasize the harmful effects of conformity to certain traditional masculine ideal behaviors such as dominance, self-reliance, and competition. Wikipedia

And the example of masculinity that is not toxic is…?

Re: No evidence that testosterone reduces cognitive empathy

#253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whether or not they are absurdities is obviously a contention, and hence, whether or not they are being disrespected. It's not contentious that you should show people you're in discussion with respect, nor that you have not shown said respect.

So do you believe they're absurd?

Please don't do tit-for-tat flamewars like this on HN. The further they get to the right of the page, the nastier and more repetitive they get, and curiosity has been lost long ago.

You guys have been going at it in other subthreads too. That's not what this site is for. In the future, please take a step back and refrain.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: No evidence that testosterone reduces cognitive empathy

#254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You think you aren't, but you are when you say the categories of "male, female and 3rd sex" are appropriate for simplifying the "absurdities". You should show people who fit in your "absurd" minority sexual categories with more respect in future.

Whether or not they are absurdities is obviously a contention, and hence, whether or not they are being disrespected. It's not contentious that you should show people you're in discussion with respect, nor that you have not shown said respect.

Please don't do tit-for-tat flamewars like this on HN. The further they get to the right of the page, the nastier and more repetitive they get, and curiosity has been lost long ago.

You guys have been going at it in other subthreads too. That's not what this site is for. In the future, please take a step back and refrain.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: No evidence that testosterone reduces cognitive empathy

#255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Toxic masculinity refers to traditional cultural masculine norms that can be harmful to men, women, and society overall; this concept of toxic masculinity is not intended to demonize men or male attributes, but rather to emphasize the harmful effects of conformity to certain traditional masculine ideal behaviors such as dominance, self-reliance, and competition. Wikipedia

And the example of masculinity that is not toxic is…?

The behaviour I mentioned above, which runs counter to the "self-reliance" mentioned in an example in the definition.

Re: No evidence that testosterone reduces cognitive empathy

#256
post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do I believe what are absurd? I've already had enough equivocation for one thread, please be specific when you post. I looked at the first two lists of gender identities my search returned and there were plenty of absurd categories (like Maverique and Novigender ). In addition, the idea that public policy and law should revolve around people choosing their identities on a day to day basis is, I believe, unworkable, i…

You've said a few times that "No one is arguing for disrespect of anyone", but the case you quote does argue that point explicitly. He knew his stance would cause offence and even harm. His argument was that his employers should ignore that because of his convention rights to religious freedom. > It is deeply disturbing that this is the first time in the history of English law that a judge has ruled that free citizen…

> You've said a few times that "No one is arguing for disrespect of anyone", but the case you quote does argue that point explicitly.

> He knew his stance would cause offence and even harm. His argument was that his employers should ignore that because of his convention rights to religious freedom.

Knowing that what you say may be offensive is not the same as arguing for the disrespect of someone. The judgement also does not contain the word disrepect and it is not part of his defence that it is his intention to disrespect anyone. Much as I disagree with why he's doing it, he is being compelled. Again, to compel has a well worn definition, if you will be fired unless you do certain things you are being compelled, so I disagree with your description.

I have nothing further to add.

Re: No evidence that testosterone reduces cognitive empathy

#257
post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've said a few times that "No one is arguing for disrespect of anyone", but the case you quote does argue that point explicitly. He knew his stance would cause offence and even harm. His argument was that his employers should ignore that because of his convention rights to religious freedom. > It is deeply disturbing that this is the first time in the history of English law that a judge has ruled that free citizen…

> You've said a few times that "No one is arguing for disrespect of anyone", but the case you quote does argue that point explicitly. > He knew his stance would cause offence and even harm. His argument was that his employers should ignore that because of his convention rights to religious freedom. Knowing that what you say may be offensive is not the same as arguing for the disrespect of someone. The judgement also…

So your argument is that being offensive to someone isn't the same as being disrespectful? Like, I am genuinely curious about how you're justifying this to yourself.
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