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Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

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Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#251

Post by sokoloff »

teen wrote: post #177
blunte wrote: post #145

Maybe because I'm outside the unicorn bubble I can't see the magic, but I find something very warped about a business strategy that combines stratospheric valuation, intentional regulatory non-compliance, perpetual capital injections, service misrepresentation, and unprofessional corporate behavior... and results in massive financial losses year after year. When I try to balance the elements, it frankly looks like an…

Not sure how all three of drivers, Uber's profit, and passengers could all be losing. I think passengers are making out quite well atm. I haven't owned a car since Uber has been around, and get chaffeured around at a super affordable price.

Most of the Uber drivers I speak with are also doing better than if Uber didn't exist. (Naturally, if they didn't believe that, they wouldn't be driving for Uber still, but even as I engage halfway deeply into how it's going for them, most of them seem to genuinely understand the costs and have good reason to believe they're being made [sometimes much] better off by driving for Uber.)

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#252

Post by hopler »

sherlock_h wrote: post #31

Over the long run, at least in the U.S. it seems like Uber/Lyft are edging towards a comfortable duopoly. Usually their prices move in lockstep (each has insights into the other company's prices through email receipt intelligence, credit card intelligence, webscraping, etc.). And their services are fairly exchangeable. For either one to win there needs to be either a massive cost advantage or some sort of stickiness…

There's a time limit on this. 10years later, it's much easier to clone Uber's business and recruit the same drivers (Uber's desert for not hiring drivers as proper employees)

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#253

Post by chimeracoder »

starik36 wrote: post #203
funkaster wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The taxi experience in cities other than NYC, Chicago, and SF got a million times better. It wouldn't be fair to NYC and Chicago to compare them to SF. In my mind, the completely horrible broken experience of the SF taxi system was what created Uber & friends. I've been living in SF pre-Uber and having moved from a big city, the taxi system just drove me nuts, I could not understand why it was that fucked up. If it…

The part I really disliked about the NYC cabs is that you never knew how much it going to cost you. And similarly the driver never knew where they would have to go. With Uber, both parties have this information ahead of time. Huge improvement.

> The part I really disliked about the NYC cabs is that you never knew how much it going to cost you.

For black cab service, yes, you did. For medallion (yellow) cabs, it's always metered (except for the airport flat rate).

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#254

Post by 1stcity3rdcoast »

pmart123 wrote: post #201
treis wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Maybe because I'm outside the unicorn bubble I can't see the magic, but I find something very warped about a business strategy that combines stratospheric valuation, intentional regulatory non-compliance, perpetual capital injections, service misrepresentation, and unprofessional corporate behavior... and results in massive financial losses year after year. >When I try to balance the elements, it frankly looks like…

I’d agree with Uber making a big positive impact, but without the iPhone, there is no Uber. I’m not sure many remember the challenges to ordering a taxi/booking a ride pre-Uber. The problem though is it is very much like the airline industry pre 2014. It is a challenging business model with a lot a capital and resources required to make it work. Ironically, Travis probably could have sold Uber Eats to Amazon now and…

I used to call Uber in the early 2010-2012 days on my Blackberry by texting my current location. Worked great even without an app.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#255

Post by astazangasta »

treis wrote: post #183
blunte wrote: post #145

Maybe because I'm outside the unicorn bubble I can't see the magic, but I find something very warped about a business strategy that combines stratospheric valuation, intentional regulatory non-compliance, perpetual capital injections, service misrepresentation, and unprofessional corporate behavior... and results in massive financial losses year after year. When I try to balance the elements, it frankly looks like an…

>Maybe because I'm outside the unicorn bubble I can't see the magic, but I find something very warped about a business strategy that combines stratospheric valuation, intentional regulatory non-compliance, perpetual capital injections, service misrepresentation, and unprofessional corporate behavior... and results in massive financial losses year after year. >When I try to balance the elements, it frankly looks like…

Just like everything with Uber this is hooey. (3) does not appear to be true. https://www.thegeneralautoquotes.com/resources/uber-affectin... (2) may be true but only because Uber is subsidizing its expansion with a mountain of capital. It can't actually sustain the expanded driver pool, which also makes driving unliveable for individual drivers.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#256

Post by joefourier »

hash872 wrote: post #81
georgeecollins wrote: post #23

I don't know what to say about this because as a lifelong value investor I cannot accept the valuation of Uber based on it's earnings. But the same logic held me back from investing in Facebook and Google, which did not make any sense to me at the moment of their IPO. How do I decide what Uber's earnings will be in five years?

I can't speak as to what Uber's earnings will be 5 years from now, but I can recommend Stratechery by Ben Thompson as a way of understanding tech company's 'moats'. And how they're qualitatively different from moats enjoyed by other monopsonies in lower-tech eras

Is Uber really a tech company? Sure they do some R&D on the side, but they are first and foremost a mostly unlicensed taxi company with a ride-hailing app - I think the proper term is "e-hailing company".

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#257

Post by josefx »

warp_factor wrote: post #98
justfor1comment wrote: post #80

Uber is getting more expensive with time as they try to consolidate losses. For my commute to work nowadays Express Pool costs the same as UberX did a year ago. And of course express pool includes overtly long sight seeing detours and dangerous pick up/drop off points. This is getting prohibitively expensive and I plan to switch to an electric scooter + public transit in a few months.

This is a good summary of the VC economy: Use it as long as it is subsidized by VC Money, then switch back to whatever you used before.

That only works if the VC money runs out before your alternative goes out of business. A company with enough reserves killing local competition by undercuting it so much that everyone trying to compete has to lose money isn't unheard of.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#258

Post by foobiekr »

computerex wrote: post #96
amoitnga wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not an investor, no experience, just want to voice my 2c. - facebook and google sure, but how many are there of those who didn't make it? - sounds like a fear of missing out. - Buffet didn't invest in Microsoft because he didn't "get it". His idea, I believe, is: "it's ok to pass on investments". He's looking for "sure things". Personally, I think the entire thing is ridiculous. 120B ? for what? 2 of my friends a…

Don't forget that Uber is in the autonomous driving business. They burnt through cash to get market share, because when self driving becomes a thing, they'll have a huge swing in margins/profits as self driving will get rid of their greatest expense (human drivers).

Uber is also in the flying taxi business.

Alternately, Uber attaches their public messaging to external hype cycles and, in fact, is just a taxi business.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#259

Post by eeeeeeeeeeeee »

bduerst wrote: post #169
blunte wrote: post #145

Maybe because I'm outside the unicorn bubble I can't see the magic, but I find something very warped about a business strategy that combines stratospheric valuation, intentional regulatory non-compliance, perpetual capital injections, service misrepresentation, and unprofessional corporate behavior... and results in massive financial losses year after year. When I try to balance the elements, it frankly looks like an…

Passengers won, since most rides were (or still are) subsidized from venture capital raised by the company. It's almost like a wealth distribution of it's own, through the value of on-demand transportation. You could also talk about how it disrupted the taxi medallion market, which was an older solution to the trust problem of getting into a car with a stranger, but for many cities that wasn't really in need of disru…

Passengers win for now, not necessarily won for good.

Do you think the public markets are going to allow Uber to keep bleeding this much cash year over year?

Prices will go up on consumers just as Uber has completely dominated the market and effectively has no competition. They’ll be able to charge whatever they want.

Re: Uber Revenue Growth Slows, Losses Persist as 2019 IPO Draws Near

#260

Post by komali2 »

bambax wrote: post #218
komali2 wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, a bicycle. You can get a good one on craigslist for a hundred bucks if you're patient. You may get a bit sweatier but you'll get an exercise ;) Or, there's no hills, and you go your own pace, and it's fine. Having tried both I do feel bicycles are safer - those tiny scooter wheels shake me to pieces.

I built an electric bike from an inexpensive normal bike + Bafang motor. Total cost <$1000. I have never been happier with a vehicle. This is really the best of all worlds.

Oh snap, got a blog post or anything? Would love to kick a motor on to help on the incline home.
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