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How Restaurants Got So Loud

theatlantic.com

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Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#251

Post by GarrisonPrime »

clairity wrote: post #227
decebalus1 wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It probably won't be the most popular opinion but I'm siding with the business for this one. I never got people who use cafe bars, delis, etc.. as personal offices. I personally can't get 'in the zone' in such a public place where: - I need to buy/consume something every X minutes - have to overhear irrelevant stupid/mundane conversations - people have a habit of bringing their dogs everywhere now and I'm not even go…

even if you don't relate, other people have different desires and motivations and it's worth trying to understand that (for social harmony at the very least). you seem to want quiet and solitude in public places, but that's just not the norm. rather than distracting, i find cafes ideal places to work, as they have the right amount of low-recognition distraction (unlike home, where things are too quiet and my bed is s…

I suspect you intended your comment to be along the lines of "different strokes for different folks", but it pretty strongly came across as "you're weird and wrong; here's the correct way to view things".

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#252

Post by dreamcompiler »

jlokier wrote: post #108

There's an ice cream and bagel place in town. In the late evening it's consistently packed with people on their laptops or reading books. One day I noticed the music was much louder than usual, and asked the staff to turn it down. I figured it was a mistake because it was normally much quieter. They told me this was the new company policy. To set the music uncomfortably loud to make people leave, after finishing thei…

I just spent a month in continental Europe, and the cafes and restaurants there are very different than in the US. In the US, restaurants want you to leave ASAP so they can turn the tables quickly. In Europe, they're perfectly happy to let you linger all day. I even became annoyed that nobody in a European restaurant would ever bring me the check. (Finally I learned to just get up and go to the register; this seemed a perfectly fine solution.)

Another commenter here said this was because US servers depended on tips, while tipping is not done in European restaurants. Maybe so; overall I like the European method much better.

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#253

Post by MandieD »

amluto wrote: post #138
err4nt wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny how obvious some people make it that they don't want business. I don't really care about power plugs or wifi when I visit a café (my battery running out is a great motivator + natural time limit, I can tether to my phone for internet) but I always pay close attention to how a new café is outfitted. Some cafés that genuinely want your business make plugs available to the customers, some will even go as far…

In Palo Alto, there’s a cafe (more or less) call Hana House that has three big sections. One of those sections is very comfy, quiet, has proper acoustic design, lots of outlets, and, gasp charges for time. It’s actually a fairly nice model. If you want to work in someone’s commercial space, paying for it is entirely reasonable.

Is that the one owned by SAP?

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#254

Post by rzzzt »

amluto wrote: post #138
err4nt wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny how obvious some people make it that they don't want business. I don't really care about power plugs or wifi when I visit a café (my battery running out is a great motivator + natural time limit, I can tether to my phone for internet) but I always pay close attention to how a new café is outfitted. Some cafés that genuinely want your business make plugs available to the customers, some will even go as far…

In Palo Alto, there’s a cafe (more or less) call Hana House that has three big sections. One of those sections is very comfy, quiet, has proper acoustic design, lots of outlets, and, gasp charges for time. It’s actually a fairly nice model. If you want to work in someone’s commercial space, paying for it is entirely reasonable.

HanaHaus is a deliberate coworking place-café combination: http://www.hanahaus.com/about/

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#255

Post by yellowapple »

jlokier wrote: post #108

There's an ice cream and bagel place in town. In the late evening it's consistently packed with people on their laptops or reading books. One day I noticed the music was much louder than usual, and asked the staff to turn it down. I figured it was a mistake because it was normally much quieter. They told me this was the new company policy. To set the music uncomfortably loud to make people leave, after finishing thei…

Sounds like there'd be a good market for places that charge you for the time you spend in them rather than for the merchandise. Maybe just a bunch of desks and someone walking around with coffee/tea and snacks (free or cheap). Charge, say, $10/hour.

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#257

Post by lodi »

kevincennis wrote: post #132
whatshisface wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Noise is noise, and if you cancel it out it's gone. Sound waves obey the superposition principle, which means that if I take 1 psi and superimpose -1 psi, I get 1-1=0 psi.

That's true, of course. But it's much harder to actively cancel higher frequencies. This is why noise cancelling works brilliantly on an airplane (relatively low frequency background noise) but it does almost nothing to filter out the sounds of conversations around you.

High frequencies are passively attenuated by the foam inside the earcups. It's the mid frequencies (speech, etc.) that survive both active and passive noise cancellation. Still, a high end pair of ANC headphones does a good job on speech/tv if you have some soft music playing through them.

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#258

Post by war1025 »

keiferski wrote: post #17
willvarfar wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a big fan of the making-libraries-loud (loud as in happy) movement, but I'm usually bringing my kids to browse the shelves and pick books to bring home, not to actually spend time there reading them. In my experience kids find quiet libraries intimidating. (Which is at odds with my own preferences, I should add, but I prioritize the kids.) What the libraries need is a quiet reading room, rather like the trains ha…

Libraries are not playgrounds. This idea that the primary functional purpose of an important space should be some kind of afterthought is rather depressing, but I guess is follows from the entertainment-centric culture we live in. The purpose of a library is to read, not to entertain your kids.

The purpose of a public library (at least in the US) is to provide services to the public. A large part of the public, especially who aren't otherwise occupied during the day, are young children.

Most libraries I've been to have a large section dedicated to kids books and activities, often with stuff animals, blocks, etc that kids can use for creative play.

There are usually also rooms that you can reserve for work or study, and tables out in the open that people can sit at to read or work.

Kids are loud and energetic. Usually older people enjoy the vitality they bring to a space. The main age group bothered by them are 20 and 30 somethings who don't have kids and aren't used to being around them.

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#259

Post by [deleted] »

jtreminio wrote: post #238
sequoia wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Respectfully, this advice is absolutely idiotic. If your toddler pees their pants, do you rub their face in it too? I'm not a proponent of treating children identically to adults, but children should still be afforded some aspects of human dignity. Spraying them with a water bottle like a malfeasant feline is not a polite way to treat anyone, regardless of age. If you do this to your child, you are teaching them that…

Don't be respectful, it's a copy/paste for how to shut up meowing/misbehaving cats.

[deleted]

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#260

Post by clairity »

GarrisonPrime wrote: post #251
clairity wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

even if you don't relate, other people have different desires and motivations and it's worth trying to understand that (for social harmony at the very least). you seem to want quiet and solitude in public places, but that's just not the norm. rather than distracting, i find cafes ideal places to work, as they have the right amount of low-recognition distraction (unlike home, where things are too quiet and my bed is s…

I suspect you intended your comment to be along the lines of "different strokes for different folks", but it pretty strongly came across as "you're weird and wrong; here's the correct way to view things".

yes, it wasn't meant to make a claim on rightness or wrongness (although i can understand why it might come across that way), but to make a point about perspectives.

and that point was not so much "different strokes for different folks", but "different strokes for the same folks", as we each embody multiple perspectives and our conscious brain can choose among them (a lesson i keep learning over and over).

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