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European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

europa.eu

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Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#251

Post by petecox »

laumars wrote: post #112
vivan wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is fair enough - though is there really any competition in that space? Even if Google did nothing, I imagine most manufacturers would continue using Android as there isn't much choice. I don't actually know any mobile OS other than iOS and Android variants. Blackberry, Nokia (?) and Windows for mobile are all pretty much dead at this point.

There used to be a plethora of mobile platforms: * Symbian * Palm webOS * Mozilla (I think that was also called WebOS?) * Jola * Some blackberry thing based on QNX that "supported" Android apps * Tizan * Windows Phone * Ubuntu Phone Plus a bunch of independent / hobby(?) ones that never really took off, eg the Inferno port These days it feels like most people have given up trying to compete against Apple and Google.

Mozilla's effort was Firefox OS (or Boot To Gecko), now forked as KaiOS.

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#252

Post by ewoodrich »

lucb1e wrote: post #228
theBobBob wrote: post #103

Very slightly off topic but I actually think how Android handles default apps is the best of both worlds. It comes with very very good default Google Apps that work well together but it is very easy to switch out whatever you want for an alternative. How iOS handles it is the opposite. For their default apps they either straight out not allow competitors, severely limit what their competitors or (if I remember correc…

> but it is very easy to switch out whatever you want for an alternative Do tell how one could switch out the map from Google Maps to anything else (Bing, OpenStreetMap, whatever). Or how I could get rid of Google+ without needing to wipe my device or use a zero-day. Or perhaps how I could get apk files from their repository without agreeing to the Google TOS and privacy policy, and without using some hacky system li…

The OP was talking about built-in Android support for changing defaults using intents. It's a pop-up menu, and is pretty easy to understand even for non-HN users.

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#253

Post by SparklingCotton »

cageface wrote: post #231
vivan wrote: post #2

Can anyone concisely explain what this fine is for, and also why the same wouldn't apply to Apple for iOS? It seems to be a rehash of the issue that Microsoft faced when it only gave you Internet Explorer on install. But iOS comes with only Safari on install, and forces you to use Apple's various apps - how is this any different?

Apple defenders will dismiss market share when comparing Android and iOS and claim that share of profits is all that counts. But they're happy to use market share to justify sanctions against Google. You can't have it both ways folks. The fact is that Apple controls enough of the users that everybody wants that they have at least as much influence as Google does in mobile. That they've chosen to protect their fat pro…

> If the EU wants to preserve any credibility ..

It's the other way around. EU is building credibility that seems to be lacking elsewhere by penalizing anti-competitive behavior.

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#254

Post by menegattig »

movedx wrote: post #249
menegattig wrote: post #244

IMHO, antitrust fines/penalties should change from amount of money to some other type of penalty, like temporary market exclusion/block or something, otherwise companies like Google and others can simply use its cash (that's was also made due to the unfair advantage), pay the fine and move on to the next market dominance. They will always have cash to pay, even if the fines are higher and higher. They kind of expect…

I reckon companies like Google, Microsoft, Apple, $bigCorp, probably calculate the ROI of the venture before executing it. So for example in this case, I wouldn't be surprised if Google calculated a high chance of pocketing $5b and expected (lobbied) to be fined much, much less, leaving them with a big profit anywhere. And if they don't get caught or fined: win.

Totally agree.

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#255

Post by ToFab123 »

codeulike wrote: post #92
amelius wrote: post #55

I'm wondering how such a fine actually comes into existence. How does some EU committee get the idea that Google is anti-competitive here? Is this the result of lobbying by competitors? Can we somehow post the EU about instances where companies are being anti-competitive, and get them to take action somehow? Given the enormous amount of anti-competitive behavior we see every day in the news, I can't help but feel thi…

Well if there was one group I would expect to complain about anti-competitive behaviour, that would probably be competitors.

In a monopoly situation there a not many competitors. It is a monopoly. mono = one

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#256

Post by appleflaxen »

there is a lot of criticism of the EC by the HN community, but I am extremely happy to have some push-back against the oligopoly of Apple, Google, etc.

let's do apple, facebook, and amazon next.

now if we could only convince comcast to provide services to the EU....

having a small set of companies controlling everything harms all consumers.

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#258

Post by cncrnd »

ginko wrote: post #232
cncrnd wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not evidence, charges were issued years ago based on past behavior. Until there is a decision made, why should Google change it's behavior? My view on this situation is that regulators should decide if such bundling is allowed on a case by case basis. Then, the ruling is 'We have made a decision. You get X fine if you do not comply.' Rather than, 'We prosecutors think you are not complying' followed by 'Yep y…

So, if you're caught parking in a handicapped spot, do you also expect a note asking you nicely to stop doing that in the future before getting a fine?

Yes, if the fine is 40% of my yearly income.

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#259

Post by r_singh »

menegattig wrote: post #244

IMHO, antitrust fines/penalties should change from amount of money to some other type of penalty, like temporary market exclusion/block or something, otherwise companies like Google and others can simply use its cash (that's was also made due to the unfair advantage), pay the fine and move on to the next market dominance. They will always have cash to pay, even if the fines are higher and higher. They kind of expect…

This makes even more sense with context from Google's deal with Apple to make Google Search the default on iPhones for which it pays $3B.

Considering that, $5B doesn't seem to be much of a fine to be literally on the head of most smartphones in the world.

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#260

Post by fwdpropaganda »

laumars wrote: post #53
muricafirst wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how about correcting the tax laws then, this is a bad way to try and get the money from them...

This isn't a revenue generating scheme. This is a fine for bad business practices. This might shock you, but not every country in the world believes companies should have free reign to do whatever the fuck they like. It's not like deregulation is a requirement for capitalism. The real problem here is the minority of Americans who live with their heads firmly up their own arses and don't have any concept of the wider…

If I may quote myself from 12 days ago https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17470247

> It's not just the administration. Every time the EU has levied fines against Google a lot of Americans on HN claim that the EU is doing it because they're jealous of how successful American businesses are.

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