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FBI Is Building a Watchlist That Gives Companies Real Time Updates on Employees

theintercept.com

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Re: FBI Is Building a Watchlist That Gives Companies Real Time Updates on Employees

#251

Post by Broken_Hippo »

wildmusings wrote: post #154

All other issues aside, I really don't like that arrest records show up on people's background checks. On the other hand, there are very good reasons for the public to know who the government is arresting and why. How else would the public know that the government is abusing its authority? What is the solution?

The best thing I can come up with is a system that protects the arrested's name until after a conviction. Anything released before that should include statistical data - description, race (since that is an issue), location, crime, and so on. I disagree with publishing mugshots for folks that have been found not guilty as well.

There is good and bad to all of this, of course, and some of it won't be fixed without better attuned labor protection laws and things of that nature.

Re: FBI Is Building a Watchlist That Gives Companies Real Time Updates on Employees

#252

Post by Broken_Hippo »

sidlls wrote: post #61
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> any criminal background, including arrest records Aren't arrest records for dismissed charges sealed? Innocent until proven guilty makes punishing an employee for charges unseemly. Punishing for convictions, however, strikes me as fine.

The purpose of imprisonment is to punish and, ideally, rehabilitate. Why continue the punishment for life after that?

Because the imprisonment wasn't enough. They aren't so interested in rehabilitation, I think - otherwise I'm guessing policies would be different.

Re: FBI Is Building a Watchlist That Gives Companies Real Time Updates on Employees

#253

Post by leereeves »

dragonwriter wrote: post #247
leereeves wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point being, it would be easy to end up with a witchhunt against a company for firing a couple bad employees who had also been arrested, even if the arrests had nothing to do with their dismissal.

You mean, just like the original list promotes further punishment of people who are victims of baseless arrests that don't even support prosecution much less conviction?

And responding to one potential witchhunt with another helps how?

Re: FBI Is Building a Watchlist That Gives Companies Real Time Updates on Employees

#254

Post by nl »

coderdude wrote: post #183
nl wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does Milo Yiannopoulos really match any definition of 'a conservative'? ( In an attempt to block a conservative... )

Yes, I would say that. There are a lot of people who apply different labels to the man because of what he agrees with and disagrees with. I would imagine you already have your opinion on that. It is a small fraction of the argument I just presented and I don't think it should be the focus.

Which part of the conservative mindset does he represent? I suppose he could be some kind of nationalist/native sentiment, but he doesn't seem to speak about that much.

Hopefully you noticed that I didn't try to make my feelings on Mr Yiannopoulos obvious.

Re: FBI Is Building a Watchlist That Gives Companies Real Time Updates on Employees

#255

Post by coderdude »

nl wrote: post #254
coderdude wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I would say that. There are a lot of people who apply different labels to the man because of what he agrees with and disagrees with. I would imagine you already have your opinion on that. It is a small fraction of the argument I just presented and I don't think it should be the focus.

Which part of the conservative mindset does he represent? I suppose he could be some kind of nationalist/native sentiment, but he doesn't seem to speak about that much. Hopefully you noticed that I didn't try to make my feelings on Mr Yiannopoulos obvious.

I appreciate your response but I want to respectfully decline to comment further. I don't feel comfortable expressing my political opinions here. That includes things that would be tangentially related.

Re: FBI Is Building a Watchlist That Gives Companies Real Time Updates on Employees

#256

Post by nl »

griffinmmahon wrote: post #201
coderdude wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Make no mistake, this was absolutely about shutting people up that they don't agree with. The harassment we're actually seeing in any tangible form is coming from the rioters.

>shutting people up that they don't agree with Yes, but people are allowed to do that . I don't think "free speech" means what you think it means. It's a comforting idea that other people are too immature/emotional/dumb to consciously think about an opposing belief, but that wasn't the case here. There's no obligation to hear out a side that would do you harm given the choice. w/r/t letting people say unpopular thing…

While I agree that protesting someone else's speech is protected speech, I'm not sure that hitting people with poles or pepper spraying them is the same.

Re: FBI Is Building a Watchlist That Gives Companies Real Time Updates on Employees

#257

Post by nl »

coderdude wrote: post #255
nl wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which part of the conservative mindset does he represent? I suppose he could be some kind of nationalist/native sentiment, but he doesn't seem to speak about that much. Hopefully you noticed that I didn't try to make my feelings on Mr Yiannopoulos obvious.

I appreciate your response but I want to respectfully decline to comment further. I don't feel comfortable expressing my political opinions here. That includes things that would be tangentially related.

And I appreciate your polite response.

Re: FBI Is Building a Watchlist That Gives Companies Real Time Updates on Employees

#258

Post by thehardsphere »

leereeves wrote: post #75
drawkbox wrote: post #28

Protesting peacefully is an American right, this will be a list of real patriots. However, this is a bit scary. Corporations have become the brownshirts and we are inching towards a one-party authoritarian system like China it seems. Unfortunately the divide and conquer strategy of the two party system in the US makes people honor party over country and this is a problem. The only solution is to be more independent.…

> this will be a list of real patriots. Isn't this is a list of all arrests, not merely protesters?

The list is of people who underwent a pre-employment biometric background check. So, roughly, anybody who works for a bank, is a public school teacher, acquires a security clearance, or is in the military. The level of "real patriotism" on the list is going to roughly correspond with the "real patriotism" of those groups of people.

I don't understand why there's so much fascination with the idea that this is some protester-busting tool. The article merely posits the hypothetical scenario that some people could be punished by their employer, because their employer might get a rap back and they wouldn't be able to tell it was First Amendment activity as opposed to some actual serious crime, because the FBI and local law enforcement is bad at data entry. Somehow people read that and think that the point of the whole system is "corporate fascism stopping the patriotic protesting democracy" when none of the employers actually care about that. Or in other words, an emergent problem in the system that might occur is being assumed to be the central planned feature of it.

Re: FBI Is Building a Watchlist That Gives Companies Real Time Updates on Employees

#259

Post by ihsw »

mattnewton wrote: post #215
ihsw wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Protesting peacefully != destroying private property and committing unprovoked acts of violence to innocents There's a word for those that use random violence to effect change in society -- terrorists.

The word terrorist apparently means whoever the government disagrees with. Others are rebels, patriots and freedom fighters.

No, if they're with a stated purpose then that's entirely different, but if it's just random violence for the sake of expressing your feelings then that's disgusting and uncalled for.

We are all patriots, but we're not all terrorists that use random violence to effect change.

Re: FBI Is Building a Watchlist That Gives Companies Real Time Updates on Employees

#260

Post by Anthony-G »

verandaguy wrote: post #156
suprgeek wrote: post #14

Beautiful - Go to protest against Trump (or even to document it [1]) - get arrested and charged with "Rioting", "Disturbing the Peace" or my most favorite "Resisting Arrest[2]" - get an Arrest Record - Get fired immediately thanks to RAP BACK - Charges get dropped. Rinse and repeat. Welcome Absolute Fascism. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/media/2017/jan/24/journalists-ch... [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_con…

Charges get dropped I think I'm missing something; why would the charges get dropped?

In Ireland, I've seen police arrest people for attending a political demonstration. In the past (roughly 7-15 years ago), I've witnessed enough people getting arrested simply because they sat on the ground as part of a group (I've always thought the ad-hoc spontaneous sit-down is a terrible idea).

Later, the charges were dropped or the police perjured themselves in court to try and secure a conviction. If the defendant was lucky, the arrest (or surrounding events) was caught on camera and the police were shown to be lying. Otherwise, police testimony is usually enough to convict a protester. From what I read, the situation isn't any better in the US.

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